aftermarket suspesnion for the SD's

well guys, its something that is not talked about too muc but those of you that have either upgraded their forks/fork internals (as in new catridges) and/or upgraded/replaced their rear shock.

what have you used?

after the accident it looks like my forks are damaged and I might have to resort buying some near new second hand forks (insurance company is seriously stuffing me around) or i could go the whole hog and go for the good gear and may as well replace the rear shock too.

what have you guys used, where did you get them? and how much? etc. I love the SD and will not sell the thing however it may be time to cut my losses and go for new suspendors.

has anyone used the WP race cartridges.. any good? Or has anyone gone over the top and gone for a new type of fork? Throw me whatever suspension mods you have got at me... and i will be happy (just make sure to include a link too)

However, if it assists.

Fork internals; manufacturers other than WP to consider - Matris, Traxxion Dynamics, Ohlins.

I am just sorting my wifes Ducati with Traxxion Dynamics, my local suspension guru who has worked for WSB teams set me down this route. He is also an Ohlins and WP dealer, Traxxion was his choice.

That Maxton stuff is good, cant fault it for the money or the aftersales. I had it on my last fireblade. I would be inclined to believe CEREC1 on this one.

I have had both my SD's reworked on the front forks, slightly softer springs and better fluid by HM Racing. It is an improvement but that was about 300 quid as I recall. If I were to do the job again I would probably spend the bit extra for the cartridges.

Never been completely happy with the rear end of the SDR either. I think the problem is mostly nulified / dialled out when the carbon wheels are fitted but it gets a bit nasty at times on standard wheels. Again with hindsight, flogging the standard shock for 200 quid ish to an SD owner and then buying a GP10 would possibly have been a better way to go.

Surely, Go Go or Tead would be the best ones to ask?

KTech revalved rear shock ( £108 +VAT) with KTech front fork internals ( £330 +VAT ) for me.

KTech are another company who wont revalve the standard front forks as in thier words - they are rubbish and you cant get much improvement out of them!

I only rode the bike twice after the fitment and set-up and both times on the road but the difference in ride quality etc was like night and day - you suddenly realise how agriculteral the standard equipment is

Yeah sounded cheap to me as well, I have emailed Maxton to see what the options are.

Received this from Maxton

Cameron

Thanks for your enquiry, we can help you out with the problem on your forks
but have no spec sheet for you to read. We convert your forks, but not by
modifying the existing internals. We throw everything inside the fork away
and start again with our internals.

The internals we supply is our own GP20 cartridge style damping system. The
cartridge system is the same type of internal as what you would find in any
modern front fork. It has been manufactured and developed by our own
engineers and has pistons and shim stacks for the rebound and compression
damping. The Cartridge also has needle valves so you can adjust the
damping. The damping adjusters are external, so you can change the damping
without having to strip the forks down, but we hide the adjusters to keep
the classic appearance. As part of the conversion we also machine new fork
tops to take the new cartridges and damping adjusters. We also fit new
springs.

Every Maxton GP20 cartridge is built to order, the reason for this is to
valve and spring the cartridges to suit the fork, the bike, the riders
weight and what they are using the bike for. Once the cartridge has been
manufactured we then fit the cartridge to the fork to make sure it works
correctly. In most conversions we have to modify the original bottom
sliders and stanchions so our cartridge will fit and work properly. The
forks are then returned to you fully serviced with new seals and the spring
preload and damping set up.

The Maxton GP20 cartridge costs between £315.00 and £615.00 + V.A.T.
Depending on how adjustable you want the cartridge to be.

- For £315.00 + V.A.T the cartridge is adjustable for rebound damping.
- For £415.00 + V.A.T the cartridge is adjustable for rebound damping and
preload.
- For £515.00 + V.A.T the cartridge is adjustable for rebound and
compression damping.
- For £615.00 + V.A.T the cartridge is adjustable for rebound and
compression damping and preload.

To service the forks with new seals and install the cartridges costs an
extra £125.00 + V.A.T on top of the cartridge.

All adjustments can be made without having to strip the forks down.

LOL - reads like a canned e-mail sent to someone with a damper-rod front end, getting a cartridge re-do. I hope you don't take this this wrong way, but if you don't recognize that - then you're going to get ripped off.

Just like Maxton's stuff, The WP forks have pistons and shim stacks for the rebound and compression damping. The WP forks also have needle valves so you can adjust the damping. They are external too - not hidden. You can make all adjustments without having to strip down anything - lol.

A grand (US) is a lot of scratch for all the features the WP forks already have. Even a respring+revalve+the gratuitous proprietary piston is less from pretty much anyone who offers them. And the all the folks who offer their own pistons - think theirs is simply "the shit".

Seriously, those are great for putting on a Guzzi, ZRX, SV, Bonnie/Thruxton or whatever other decent bike still has damper rod front end or non-rebuildable cartridges. Sounds just like the same 20 mm cartridge product Traxxion offers.

Again, a lot of what suspension houses sell you as proprietary products - particularly the fork products - are to sell you their widgets. They are profitable. And they enable a big house to homogenize their approach to setup somewhat independent of the bike involved. I could go on and on about how you already paid once for all these parts, and why their products won't necessarily be any better than a decent re-spring and re-valve done by an honest and competent suspension house, who hasn't a product line to sell you.

I will say (again) that you have fine, fully adjustable, fully rebuild-able forks. Find an independent, well-reputed shop that's done a bunch of SuperDukes already, You'll save a bundle AND be happy with the outcome. Its your money ...

Hey Mate,

Yes I know the forks have rebound and compression and preload adjusters on them, the problem is that the rebound adjuster doesn't appear to do anything, this is on the stock forks as well as forks I have had revalved with Racetech gold valves and the shim stack adjusted have you done the bounce test on your forks if they are stock you will have no rebound dampening they are shit. After having racetech gold valves fitted and the shim stack changed by a guy I had heard good things about they were little different. So from my experience with these forks I am willing to entertain claims from the likes of Maxton and KTEC that these forks are indeed shit and the best route is to swap out the cartridges, the forks are definately not high quality kit as was claimed in many magazines.

Cheers Cameron

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You can check them out.

http://www.gforcesuspensionservices.co. ... ducts.mspx.

Mostly MX but can do WP Road.

its official, the new bikes suspenders mixed with the Dunlop Sportsmarts have the superduke running perfectly... so easy and confident to drop her on her ear and nail it through the corner.

Just amazing!!!! better than it has ever been before!!!

+1 to that

High speed stability isn't really too much of an issue for me either, but front end grip is. If your pulling it in tight surely you need all the front end you can get which would mean increased trail figure would help along with running the rebound slightly softer. Always hard to fight the urge to dial in rebound though. I love the bike with the rebound cranked up a hit but al its doing is bringing the limit that bit closer to the rider. M m m m must resist.

Dropping the forks, even 9mm, is still above the bolt. 5mm would be safe bit we figured 9mm is the absolute furthest we can go with it. The top triple is 25mm deep. It's a band-aid, I agree, but I'm cool with running it like that until I get the $800+ USD for the Nichols triple. Looking forward to feeling the bike on track with a much higher trail figure. I was running them 8mm protruding previously when I crashed it. It was a front end tuck timebomb waiting to go off........and it did.

With 40mm rear sag its trying to rip the pegs and clutch casing off it. Even dialing in the damping it was still making a bit of a mess of the rear tyre. For this season I've fitted rearsets and will run the bike at 35mm rear and see how it goes.

Since the rebuild the bike as 95% track so it'll be lucky if it does 1000miles a year. Coz of this the way I go with set up is always gonna be different from a longer distance canyon bike.

I know I'm no geometechnitionry...type guy, but Viking is on an 05/06 with steeper rake/less trail and Mr Z32 is on an 08 with less rake/more trail...
Viking has dropped forks increasing trail, Mr Z32 has raised (maybe) to decrease trail...
I wonder whether your figures are almost the same?

Viking, I have a simple solution for you, reduce your front sag to 35mm and take the forks the flush in the triples, bringing you into a more ideal sag number and giving a propper clamping area pressure for the triples all while keeping your current geometry.

But you are correct with the rear.. 35Mm works well. But if your bike is basically a streetable track bike... I would take your bike to close to zero static sag and rider sag at 30mm front and rear... Which is the amount that a few of the SD battle bikes were running. They seemed to do ok racing without any special triples or ride height adjusters.

I'm not knocking you for doing what you have done as I understand what you are trying to achieve, however it does make me nervous seeing it while keeping in mind how much you like wheelies.

And lastly... If you don't want to loose the front... Get it on the gas early and don't lift of and I don't mean slamming it on, feed it... We have long swingarms... Huge mechanical grip in the rear and a bigger contact patch too so if your worried about the front, keep the weight over the rear tyre and all is solved.

Mines an 05 also, forks up 1mm, 33mm front sag, 37mm rear, no issues with front grip, my cornering style is similar to MrZ32, get the bike turned fast and tight,power on very early, you cant lose the front with the power on, less time/distance loading the front

Fair enough guys. It's good to bounce a few ideas about. Don't worry about debating it out, I'm not the kinda guy to take offence at anything. I'll come back to this thread later in the year and try a few of your sag ideas. There was a reason I went to 40mm front, can't remember off the top of my head. All my track notes and settings are with the bike so I'll have it noted down somewhere.

Gonna have to agree to disagree on the throttle info. I ride it differently to that and need a confident front end. Seems to work. It's definitely possible to loose the front on the throttle though. No point getting into riding advice on the net. We don't know each others abilities. One man's fast is another man's slow. We can have two guys with opposing setups and riding styles but stil put in the same times. I just gotta work with my bike and style.

Dropped the shock off today for revalving and service at my suspension guy.

Had a good long chat with him about the trail theorys and what to do. Came up with a few good ideas we're going to run with. He's going to go up slightly on the fork springs as I'm struggling to get a lot more adjustments on preload if I need it. I can't quite get to MrZ's 30mm reading if I wanted to try it on the std springs

One idea is to extend the forks internally be 5-8mm. We might be able to do that by removing the top out spring and fitting a spacer, then fitting an identical spacer at the top end so we still have enough preload adjustment. I'll post up more in a few weeks when they're stripped again.

Gratefully he's taking the time to throw around a few ideas. This guy has done the suspension for TT rider Keith Amor when he ran the circuits, and Birnie's Scottish Championship winning bike, so I'm confident we can get a result here. He's also in contact with Alister who ran at the front of the UK Superduke battle. Interestingly he recons we might struggle to find out what the battle bikes did to their forks and setups. One make series are so closely fought every tiny mod is a closely guarded secret. Going to make a few phone calls and try and glean some info.

Managed to work a good deal on Bridgestone R10's too so I'll switch to them as soon as he Metzelers are dead.

The WP bits are already very good. Not sure what going through all the effort of revalving, replacing will accomplish. The forks work good, but yeah, they are stiff and its a firm ride.

If there is any fault, its the rear shock. I had a hard time to get that setup the way I wanted. I took it to the local suspension guru and he was able to sort it out.

That said, traxxion does good work and have heard alot of good things about them.

i phoned k tech today to inquire about the front piston kit and a rear revalve the piston kit is no longer avaiable, and they wont be making anymore as they found they did,nt realy do much, after fitting my 190nm rear spring the rear is quite harsh and think it needs a revalve? it also locks up real easy on downshifts even on the road, plr are gonna do a bit more research for me and see what they can come up with

well if you are in QLD... dont get your suspension done by MPE

get it done by Suspension Improvements across the road from Dave Kellet... best thing i ever did

Has anyone tried the WP KTM PP fork cartridge kit? I know its majorly expensive, but I just wondered if it worked?

maxton quoted me 550 in the summer for the fork cartridge kit and 800 for a new shock which is an awful lot of lolly,

Nitron build evry shock to customer spec. I'm not aware of them doing a SD one yet.

They have a fantastic repution within race paddocks.