Read-only archiveOriginal forum posts · 2005–2020

Another Superduke down, front brakes again!!!

84 posts · Started by Blaster · 20 Mar 2009

Archived topic · Replies closedJump to last post ↓

Post 1 by Blaster,

#1
Riding back from work, fine and dry, a pleasant Spring evening, doing 40mph, on a straight road, 300yards from home. I felt a slight binding sensation from the front wheel, less than half a second later I’m over the bars tw@tting my head and hip into the tarmac. It’s dark, but I can see damage to the throttle, panels, brake lever, R&Gs and GB Racing cover. My Arai is trashed and my leathers are scuffed. The front wheel is almost locked solid.

At the moment I have a small headache and a hip that is throbbing. I feel sorry for myself, tomorrow I’m at work at six am, after that I’m going to get angry. Does anyone know where the nearest dealer to Preston is now that Robinson’s has gone under, also what success have people had in getting KTM to acknowledge that the brakes on the Superduke are potential killers?

Post 2 by Silverback,

#2
We should collect all our front brake cases and send them to Mattinghoven so KTM can fix this with some kind of recall action.

Post 3 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#3
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 4 by Motohooligan,

#4
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 5 by cjc,

#5
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 6 by Don Mega,

#6
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 7 by Motohooligan,

#7
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 8 by TBird,

#8
he has an 07.

Anybody know which type came on that year?

As much as I loathe lawsuits, you guys seem to have cause. (I'm assuming you've kept them maintained.)

What was the cause you guys figured out? They don't like persistent water? Has it happened in drier climates?

What mileage?

Post 9 by Andy,

#9
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 10 by kendo57,

#10
Though not the same cause...I (literally) feel the pain. Get well soon and here's hoping the pain doesn't get worse. Pretty betrayed feelin' knowing it was the equipment that did you in. Hang tight.

Post 11 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#11
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 12 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#12
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 13 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#13
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 14 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#14
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 15 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#15
ii see that others have said in other threads what I said, but now it seems that there have been some cases with other bikes.

the master cylinder, isn't it also a standard Brembo unit?

it seems like some cases are to do with corrosion conditions. I don't think the manual has sservice for brakes any more frequent than jap bikes...with Nissin and Tokico brakes...?
scary. seems like a good idea to check them often.

Post 16 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#16
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 17 by coullstar,

#17
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 18 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#18
I was out on mine last week when there was still a little salt left. I fell of my SM at the weekend and wont be riding for at least 4 weeks plus my bike sits outside so it will be interesting to see what the front brakes are like when I get back to it. I'l try and move the bike then get the calipers off for a look as well before riding.

Post 19 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#19
Glad you're OK, but at the risk of starting a punch up, I have to agree with Digger - if you use ride a bike through the winter then you have to accept that it's going to need more tlc. I've always had 'Better safe than sorry' attitude toward winter maintenance, inlcuding tackling calipers and pads regularly with Copperslip on all sorts of bikes, Japanese or European.
The brakes aren't the problem, its the maintenance regime; whether thats KTMs responsibility or yours is up to you to argue over. As far as I'm concerned, the buck always ultimately stops with me............

Post 20 by kendo57,

#20
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 21 by superdukeblack,

#21
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 22 by superdukeblack,

#22
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 23 by superdukeblack,

#23
Did all that, plenty of TLC every weekend but once it starts to build up I can't see any way of getting it out unless you strip it, which we SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DO !!!


Post 24 by weeksy,

#24
Russ, Digger, Benters... I am sorry to hear of all of these brake failures, I am pleased that no one has been seriously hurt or G@D forbid die from this problem, I have noticed since day one that the aluminium parts on my SD look sub-standard compared to the jap bikes I have owned, my main bitch was "hard to get clean" seems to be more porous than what I am accustomed to. Inferior/premature metal fatigue should not be an issue with a bike that costs so much more than many others.

I am considering to remove the metal caliper pucks to see if I can have them anodised when I am in the area.

Has anyone taken their front brake calipers apart to get an exact diagnosis on this, I had seen something in here about it when i had first joined up, If you guys want me to I can look for the thread of topic that may address the problem directly... if it ends up being unclear and we can find no answer, you guys may know that a separated brake line that has ruptured internally can cause this sort of thing..

Post 25 by Stupid Luke,

#25
In the UK, we had some pretty icy weather (for the UK) in January and February. I washed my bike every time I rode it, it was a pain in the arse, but that is what I did. It had stood in my garage for around three weeks, before I rode it on Friday night. The last two bikes I’ve owned were Aprilias with Brembos. Plenty of problems, but none at all with the front brakes. All the other bikes I have ridden, Hondas, Kawasakis, Suzukis, BMWs and Yamahas have all had the same treatment and again no problem with the brakes. Like the vast majority of people on here I love my Superduke, if there is a problem with the brakes, or if they need more regular cleaning we need to be told. It’s not a minor issue.

On a brighter side my bike is within warranty, so it’s going to Colwyn Bay KTM for an examination. I’ll keep you informed.

Post 26 by weeksy,

#26
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 27 by kendo57,

#27
I used to work on a fleet of Police Driving School bikes [Hondas] which were cleaned and stored over winter as the school did not run in the bad weather.
When we serviced the bikes after winter we found several brake linings that had become detatched from the back plates. Water had got in from power washing and then frozen over winter forcing the lining apart.
So power washing bikes was stopped and pads were changed for each new season.
I have also seen brake pad linings become detatched on several cars when i was a mechanic.
I am not saying there is not a fault with the Brembo's but damage to brakes from salt ,ice does happen on other vehicles.

Just like to add i have not come across one that has locked the brakes on.

Post 28 by Stupid Luke,

#28
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 29 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#29
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 30 by Mr_Trecolareco,

#30
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 31 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#31
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 32 by weeksy,

#32
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 33 by weeksy,

#33
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 34 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#34
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 35 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#35
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 36 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#36
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 37 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#37
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 38 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#38
My dealer said the problem is not with the pins but the outside edge of the backing plate it too tight a fit in the housing so the smallest amount of corrosion binds them together.
His fix is to grind off a bit of metal off the egdes of the backing plates then copaslip the egdes so that there is more of a clearance and they are slightly lubricated.
Seems is a combination of backing plates the corrord too easily and too tight a fit in the housing.

Post 39 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#39
All salt is not created equal..

Post 40 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#40
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 41 by WillR,

#41
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 42 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#42
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 43 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#43
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 44 by WillR,

#44
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 45 by robbo01,

#45
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 46 by Stupid Luke,

#46
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 47 by robbo01,

#47
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 48 by Ducati Pete,

#48
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 49 by Ducati Pete,

#49
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 50 by Stupid Luke,

#50
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 51 by Stupid Luke,

#51
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 52 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#52
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 53 by FITCH,

#53
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 54 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#54
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 55 by Ducati Pete,

#55
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 56 by robbo01,

#56
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 57 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#57
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 58 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#58
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 59 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#59
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 60 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#60
I've just spent the best part of Sunday stripping the calipers, cleaning thoroughly and really carefully reassembling with new pads.

I had some corrosion and the pads were a 'sticky' fit in the caliper - but eventually came out OK.

Couple of the pads had a fair bit of 'cratering' on the surface - which I didn't like the look of.

What I did notice was that on one of the calipers only the diagonally opposed pistons were moving when operating the lever.

I eventually managed to 'massage' the pistons in and out for a bit and then was able to bleed some air out.

Can't believe how much air I've bleed from these brakes, as I've already vacuum bleed them a few months ago.

Can only think the air is trapped behind the pistons (when assembled) and its not until you fully retract the pistons a few times that it gets full dislodged into main brake hoses.

So - hopefully that will be the end of my rubbing brake problem - seems to be OK so far.

Not sure if it was the pads or air in the system - but it really isn't worth taking any chances with a bike that can build and loose speed as quick as the SD.

Post 61 by coullstar,

#61
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 62 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#62
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 63 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#63
Trouble is the dealer sent the calipers and pads off to KTM when my bike was being repaired so there is no way of knowing now, not sure if Benters knows about his yet.

I am extremely pissed off that there has benn nothign whatsoever from KTM coming back on this even though the dealer has been passing on all my emails.

They were told if I don't get an explanation by tomorrow morning, MCN. the AA and Watchdog will be hearing from me, big time.

I'm sure they would be interested to know about a manufacturer not even speaking to their customers about possible fatal problems with their bikes no matter how few they are, one biker dying becasue of this is too many.

Post 64 by WillR,

#64
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 65 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#65
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 66 by kendo57,

#66
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 67 by ShadeTheChangingMan,

#67
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 68 by kendo57,

#68
I stripped my Brakes this morning, Standard SD bought June 07 4500miles .
I only use my bike on dry days so probably not suprising that the pads looked good and came out easy, no signs of corrosion. The bike was fitted with Brembo Pads for referance.
Image[/img]

Post 69 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#69
I think the new slogan from KTM should be changed from 'Ready to Race' to

Post 70 by kendo57,

#70
Hey Kendo - have you got a picture of the pad surface ? or have you put the pads back in now - Thanks

KTM riders are hard and ride in all weather conditions - which is why no other manufactures have this problem -

Post 71 by Stratkat,

#71
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 72 by cjc,

#72
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 73 by Mr_Trecolareco,

#73
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 74 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#74
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 75 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#75
i'm sure a search for
brake (lining OR pad) corrosion salt
will turn up plenty results.

i think it's only a serious problem if you ride on salted roads.
and that bad batch (or batches?) of Hawk pads.
Brembo made by Hawk, the mystery unlisted Brembo pads, you won't find out. it's odd KTM even used parts made in USA anyway - Hawk made in Illinois.

Post 76 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#76
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 77 by smoky,

#77
here is the EBC catalog, very interesting:

has dimensions of pads
many european bikes use same pads as superduke (i think someone did point this out.) many Aprilia, Ducati, MV Agusta, Husqvarna.

Post 78 by robbo01,

#78
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 79 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#79
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 80 by robbo01,

#80
i meant to post this link with the others.


i checked mine today. still the original euro 06 brembo marked pads (i think they were stamped M5T). they're fine with no signs of any corrosion at all. (saying that, i don't ride on salted roads much but i do wash the sd a fair bit, especially when its out more during summer.)

Post 81 by Dukerider03,

#81
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 82 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#82
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 83 by russ_fae_fyvie,

#83
To take the little action they have (making a comment about washing brakes, having bikes go in for inspection of brakes) shows KTM's full realization of the problem. Anoyne looking for KTM to step up and even imply some possible responsibility, until absolutely forced or proven conclusively to be responsible will be disappointed. KTM know that any such statements would open them up to liability so they will deny, deny, deny as long as possible. Therefore, denial and silence cannot be construed as an indicator they are not undertaking testing trying to determine the exact causes. KTM simply won't divulge, until they are absolutely sure what the causes are and beyond that any information will be carefully given out to not imply any fault or liability on KTM's part.

We can bet that KTM's course is dictated by their lawyers.

Post 84 by 990EXODUS,

#84
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

End of archived topic · Posting is closedBack to top ↑
← Back to Hooliganism