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Intake mod and feasability study (dual velocity stacks)
757 posts · Started by MrZ32 · 13 Oct 2010
Post 2 by MrZ32,
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Post 3 by bic_bicknell,
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Post 4 by MrZ32,
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Post 5 by smoky,
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Post 6 by cbecker33,
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Post 7 by darko,
#7I'd be interested....particularly on a bit more mid range power and would accept a small loss at the bottom (there is plenty of torque at the low end, imho).
I don't care about materials.
Sub $100 would be the sweet spot for me.
-Chris
I don't care about materials.
Sub $100 would be the sweet spot for me.
-Chris
Post 8 by MrZ32,
#8I would accept a top end loss for a noticable increase down low and in the midrange. Would definitely NOT accept any loss at the bottom/mid.
Im rarely revving that high anyway, and I don't track my bike. A felt gain in power at the 3000-7000 range would be awesome.
As for price... hard to say, would have to see the final product. If its "just a couple of pipes" then you can only charge so much before someone rips off your product and puts something cheaper on the market.
Im rarely revving that high anyway, and I don't track my bike. A felt gain in power at the 3000-7000 range would be awesome.
As for price... hard to say, would have to see the final product. If its "just a couple of pipes" then you can only charge so much before someone rips off your product and puts something cheaper on the market.
Post 9 by MrZ32,
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Post 10 by cbecker33,
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Post 16 by MrZ32,
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Post 17 by bic_bicknell,
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Post 18 by dade,
#18I'd buy them if proved effective, would trade better mid for top.
I am not smart on physics but dont see how there's much room for changing the height of the stack, there must only be an inch max above the current oem stacks - in the MH or oem airbox?
can't go much higher before flow gets too compressed/turbulent against the roof of the box and prob. shouldn't be shorter?
I am not smart on physics but dont see how there's much room for changing the height of the stack, there must only be an inch max above the current oem stacks - in the MH or oem airbox?
can't go much higher before flow gets too compressed/turbulent against the roof of the box and prob. shouldn't be shorter?
Post 19 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 20 by superduke08,
#20ok first prototypes to be finished in the new 2 weeks (was waiting on ktm australia for parts (2 bloody months to get a simple part... useless).
pics will then follow... watch this space guys.
need a local for testing in a motobox (got the stock and grim boxes covered)
pics will then follow... watch this space guys.
need a local for testing in a motobox (got the stock and grim boxes covered)
Post 21 by MrZ32,
#21Looking forwards to seeing the results of your R&D hard work.
Post 22 by Wier,
#22I guess I should step in? (09 SDR, motobox, akras, PC3)
although Ive got the SDR, not the standard SD...
Might mess up the dyno figures if the others are standard too?
although Ive got the SDR, not the standard SD...
Might mess up the dyno figures if the others are standard too?
Post 23 by RED ZX,
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Post 24 by MrZ32,
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Post 25 by Wier,
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Post 26 by MrZ32,
#26when you drop by my way... i will see what i can do with tune ecu about throttle snatch... deel?
by the way mate... long time no see or hear
by the way mate... long time no see or hear
Post 27 by Wier,
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Post 28 by MrZ32,
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Post 29 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 30 by Wier,
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Post 31 by joebar,
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Post 32 by MrZ32,
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Post 33 by preey,
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Post 34 by dade,
#34wil they born in the next three months? (i must dyno remap befor April, so...)
Post 35 by preey,
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Post 36 by cbecker33,
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Post 37 by MrZ32,
#37why hold back, drop in the air boxes, they are very easy to remove the top off once in place... And just throw a tuneECU map in that is already available for the mean time.
Im guessing that they will be in full production within a month or two (no more missus as of last night so i have a fair bit more spare cash now).
Im guessing that they will be in full production within a month or two (no more missus as of last night so i have a fair bit more spare cash now).
Post 38 by Twisted Jester,
#38Sounds good mr Z, I look forward to seeing the results.
Post 39 by duffman,
#39Would that be a 10%-15% midrange gain on top of what you gain with the motobox ?
Post 40 by MrZ32,
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Post 41 by MrZ32,
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Post 42 by MrZ32,
#42bloody fabricators... taking forever to get it done.
ok he has been taking it easy because he is doing it at mates rates but all i want is for the tooling to be sorted... story of my life at the moment.
Too many fabricators of mine are falling behind...
ok rant over... another week and they might be ready.
Then to prove it all on the dyno.... dont worry guys i havent stalled on this. It is still happening... and will be a mod ftw!
ok he has been taking it easy because he is doing it at mates rates but all i want is for the tooling to be sorted... story of my life at the moment.
Too many fabricators of mine are falling behind...
ok rant over... another week and they might be ready.
Then to prove it all on the dyno.... dont worry guys i havent stalled on this. It is still happening... and will be a mod ftw!
Post 43 by browser,
#43im interested, in mid to top end, i dont spend much time in the bottom end of the rev range.
Post 44 by Dutch,
#44Count me in for a set.
Post 45 by preey,
#45Count me in for a set im still holding back in fitting my moto filter
Post 46 by Millar,
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Post 47 by MrZ32,
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Post 48 by dade,
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Post 49 by dade,
#49....and a question... will they work the best with the OE second butterflies, without them or with the MH ones?
Post 50 by MrZ32,
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Post 51 by MrZ32,
#51ok guys, they are coming along a lil slower than was expecting, gave them a progress claim of 400 bucks. Am going to get them to try copper as it has greater ductility (as the radius is requiring it to be made in two parts for both stainless and mild steel)
I have got a jig machined up so that is good... another propper week for the first prototype to rune on the dyno!!! finally.
Here are some pics taken today (bear in mind this is the ugly prototype). The locating fins have not been welded in yet but do work on another prototype.
obviously it is going to sit much lower insede the stock stack but it gives you an idea of size
and a picture of the failures in methods and grades of material used
I have got a jig machined up so that is good... another propper week for the first prototype to rune on the dyno!!! finally.
Here are some pics taken today (bear in mind this is the ugly prototype). The locating fins have not been welded in yet but do work on another prototype.
obviously it is going to sit much lower insede the stock stack but it gives you an idea of size
and a picture of the failures in methods and grades of material used
Post 52 by Colonel_Klinck,
#52How are these going to work with Motobox m8?
Post 53 by MrZ32,
#53they are not going to sit that proud of the standard stack when they are finished... That was just titting on a bench top... the set up will fit within the confines of the standard box... remember part of the DVS will sit below the level of the standard velocity stack...
just under 2cm proud of the top of the standard stack and 2cm proud of the bottom of the stack... missing the axle for the secondary flies (yes you will remove the flies... or lose some of the ability and make it flush with the standard stack.
The clearances aloow for enough air to be sucked through the top too.
just under 2cm proud of the top of the standard stack and 2cm proud of the bottom of the stack... missing the axle for the secondary flies (yes you will remove the flies... or lose some of the ability and make it flush with the standard stack.
The clearances aloow for enough air to be sucked through the top too.
Post 54 by loony888,
#54copper? that should negate the weight savings of your carbon fibre nicely then.................
Post 55 by Colonel_Klinck,
#55If the dyno figures add up it looks like I'm going to be ordering some performance bling and finding a tuner that is happy to use Tune ECU.
Post 56 by MrZ32,
#56you are probably looking at well and truly less than 100g all up (we are talking thin copper tube)... as opposed to the performance gains... plus anyone worth 2 cents has removed their sas... more weight there. and on that note... your PC3 should be adding weight too
plus once i have proven evidence of the DVS' working on a dyno, i am considering going to a plastic injection moulder and telling them to make a copy of the prototype... that way i can pump heaps out
plus once i have proven evidence of the DVS' working on a dyno, i am considering going to a plastic injection moulder and telling them to make a copy of the prototype... that way i can pump heaps out
Post 57 by loony888,
#57i don't have a PC III !?
yep the SAS has to go, and it's all moot anyway, they're just road bikes, if you want to talk weight how fukken heavy is the std muffler set? crikey! i nearly ruptured my blurter valve when i first lifted mine!
if you make an injection molded plastic version will you make them as a set of outers and inners? or would you still need the original stacks?
paul.
p.s, what's the measurement from the top of the velocity stack to the top of the filter element?
yep the SAS has to go, and it's all moot anyway, they're just road bikes, if you want to talk weight how fukken heavy is the std muffler set? crikey! i nearly ruptured my blurter valve when i first lifted mine!
if you make an injection molded plastic version will you make them as a set of outers and inners? or would you still need the original stacks?
paul.
p.s, what's the measurement from the top of the velocity stack to the top of the filter element?
Post 58 by Colonel_Klinck,
#58Hey mate,
I have a 2005 SD with motobox fitted and live in Brisbane if you need a non R model for testing, who's dyno were you planning on testing on?
Cheers Cameron
I have a 2005 SD with motobox fitted and live in Brisbane if you need a non R model for testing, who's dyno were you planning on testing on?
Cheers Cameron
Post 59 by MrZ32,
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Post 60 by loony888,
#60will let you know how when they are ready, in theory they should would exactly the same, so adding fuelling in the correct areas is not a drama (the 06 and 08 models have very similar fuel curves), it is just the ignition timing that vastly changes... (which is the only part that seems like it could not be carried accross.
Loony, i am unsure what you are trying to ask for... but my airbox has a 12mm clearance from the top of the DVS to the roof of the airbox which is all that is required (can cope with 6-8 mm to roof of air box before it will become detrimental). I will have to get somone with a motobox to drop by at some stage
Loony, i am unsure what you are trying to ask for... but my airbox has a 12mm clearance from the top of the DVS to the roof of the airbox which is all that is required (can cope with 6-8 mm to roof of air box before it will become detrimental). I will have to get somone with a motobox to drop by at some stage
Post 61 by SDtaxi,
#6112mm isn't much, how did you come to the conclusion that was enough clearance from the lid? do you know the maximum demand in cfm at redline? the smaller internal volume of the motobox makes a very efficient filter compulsory i would think but it seems to me by installing taller stacks you may be restricting air flow by reducing the volume of still air above the stacks opening. Longer stacks usually offer more torque as do wide bellmouths, it will be interesting to see what this mod does to the torque curve back to back.
paul
paul
Post 62 by MrZ32,
#62Any updates yet? i'm very curious..
Post 63 by Motohooligan,
#63well, im day s away from getting the first prototype pair.
Unfortunately, they are hard to make... bending steel to that level doesnt like to work, so it needs to be done in 6 pieces not 3.
So that process will go out the window, BUT if this works, I am looking into different methods of making them.
i could possibly get them made in billet for LOTS, cast (no idea how much) or injection moulded plastic for this i have no idea how much. Apparently getting the plastic moulds made are the expensive part.
when I post up the results on the dyno, i will let everyone decide on whether they would buy the modification... if enough of you do, injection moulding would be a possibility
Unfortunately, they are hard to make... bending steel to that level doesnt like to work, so it needs to be done in 6 pieces not 3.
So that process will go out the window, BUT if this works, I am looking into different methods of making them.
i could possibly get them made in billet for LOTS, cast (no idea how much) or injection moulded plastic for this i have no idea how much. Apparently getting the plastic moulds made are the expensive part.
when I post up the results on the dyno, i will let everyone decide on whether they would buy the modification... if enough of you do, injection moulding would be a possibility
Post 64 by Colonel_Klinck,
#64If you can draw in CAD sw, than you can find a company with 3D printer and they can print this parts out of plastic. So you can test it and maybe make them with the same procedure. Depends of the cost of printing.
Just an idea...
Just an idea...
Post 65 by MrZ32,
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Post 66 by MrZ32,
#66Would billet ones be uber expensive Aaron?
Post 67 by loony888,
#67Simple answer yes... 60*60*92Mm *2 blocks of aluminium with lots of wastage.
Thought of 3d printer, only concern is that it is the plastic has a low melting temp and am not sure how fuel/oil stable the plastic is.
Aaron what sort of cost would it be to machine that stuff? As cnc work in Australia is very expensive... Well not very but I couldn't make them for 100 per pair
Thought of 3d printer, only concern is that it is the plastic has a low melting temp and am not sure how fuel/oil stable the plastic is.
Aaron what sort of cost would it be to machine that stuff? As cnc work in Australia is very expensive... Well not very but I couldn't make them for 100 per pair
Post 68 by MrZ32,
#68have you tried a set of these out on a dyno yet
Post 69 by bic_bicknell,
#69Mr.Z32
In my profession I do a lot of design concepts through to production mouldings. The cost of injection moulding tool for something like this all depends on the volumes you want to make. Multiple cavity tooling brings the unit price down but costs a lot more in the first place. Probably the volumes for this item would never justify more than a single cavity tool and the cost of this would depend on whether the component could be moulded with a simple cor/cavity tool or need side cores and moving parts.
Anyway, the way to go would certainly be to make a pilot tool made from aluminium rather than tool steel. This is a fraction of the cost and is always done to test a design before committing to bulk tooling. I have a lot of contacts in the UK for doing this - especially for low runs. I could easily get a quote for producing a quick prototype tool which is not designed for high speed manufacture - more to hand assemble and produce limited numbers to test. You can get several thousand units of these tools before they wear out. I'd need a drawing or CAD data to get an accurate assessment of the comlpexity of tool required. Do you have the component built in Pro-E or some other 3D package? IGES or STEP files would be fine.
Other thing is the material you want it moulded in - this makes a difference to the tool design and allowance for shrinkage etc. Otherwise the tolerances will be out. I imagine ABS or Nylon or something but the toolmaker/moulder would want to know the temperature etc. that the unit has to operate in. The company I know does loads of prototypes for auto manufacturers - even turbo fans and so they really know their stuff.
My opinion of rapid prototyping techniques for this is that I would not offer my bike for testing with a velocity stack made from SLA or SLS or the other mentioned printing techniques. The materials are not strong enough and all I can imagine is them collapsing on the dyno and being consumed into the engine!! You'd get some interesting readings on the printout at this point. You could maybe use the SLA to make a female mould and cast prototypes in a stronger material but I'd recommend the pilot tool option.
Let me know if you want any further advice or help.
In my profession I do a lot of design concepts through to production mouldings. The cost of injection moulding tool for something like this all depends on the volumes you want to make. Multiple cavity tooling brings the unit price down but costs a lot more in the first place. Probably the volumes for this item would never justify more than a single cavity tool and the cost of this would depend on whether the component could be moulded with a simple cor/cavity tool or need side cores and moving parts.
Anyway, the way to go would certainly be to make a pilot tool made from aluminium rather than tool steel. This is a fraction of the cost and is always done to test a design before committing to bulk tooling. I have a lot of contacts in the UK for doing this - especially for low runs. I could easily get a quote for producing a quick prototype tool which is not designed for high speed manufacture - more to hand assemble and produce limited numbers to test. You can get several thousand units of these tools before they wear out. I'd need a drawing or CAD data to get an accurate assessment of the comlpexity of tool required. Do you have the component built in Pro-E or some other 3D package? IGES or STEP files would be fine.
Other thing is the material you want it moulded in - this makes a difference to the tool design and allowance for shrinkage etc. Otherwise the tolerances will be out. I imagine ABS or Nylon or something but the toolmaker/moulder would want to know the temperature etc. that the unit has to operate in. The company I know does loads of prototypes for auto manufacturers - even turbo fans and so they really know their stuff.
My opinion of rapid prototyping techniques for this is that I would not offer my bike for testing with a velocity stack made from SLA or SLS or the other mentioned printing techniques. The materials are not strong enough and all I can imagine is them collapsing on the dyno and being consumed into the engine!! You'd get some interesting readings on the printout at this point. You could maybe use the SLA to make a female mould and cast prototypes in a stronger material but I'd recommend the pilot tool option.
Let me know if you want any further advice or help.
Post 70 by MrZ32,
#70thanks for the help bic,
i will get the dyno testing done first obviously but yes I will send the '.sldprt' (i use solid works) if it works... i could also convert it to a .dxf
yeah, i had my concerns using any of the rapid prototyping plastics too (to the point where i was not going to make it that way).
hence why i had it made out of steel... strong and hardy. It is just that it is not ductile enough. I hadnt thought of machining a heat/oil resistant nylon though.... that would be cheaper.
i will get the dyno testing done first obviously but yes I will send the '.sldprt' (i use solid works) if it works... i could also convert it to a .dxf
yeah, i had my concerns using any of the rapid prototyping plastics too (to the point where i was not going to make it that way).
hence why i had it made out of steel... strong and hardy. It is just that it is not ductile enough. I hadnt thought of machining a heat/oil resistant nylon though.... that would be cheaper.
Post 71 by MrZ32,
#71ok... fabricator taking too long so i convinced him to let me come into his shop and finish it all myself on saturday.
so the prototypes will be ready by end of sat... if you are going to do something... do it yourself.
I will also look into how much it will cost to have these machined up.... in both a seriously awesome plastic or aluminium... getting quotes now
so the prototypes will be ready by end of sat... if you are going to do something... do it yourself.
I will also look into how much it will cost to have these machined up.... in both a seriously awesome plastic or aluminium... getting quotes now
Post 72 by MrZ32,
#72ok, done... they are are little rough but these are the prototypes to test the waters... if there is an improvement (which there should be), i will make a billet set (I can then do the perfect lip design... limited with current fabrication method) which will then be tested.
i was impressed with my brazing and am overall happy with this considering how many it has taken to get right.... it is good enough to work
on monday, they will be chucked in the bike for a bum dyno test then taken out again (so that back to back testing of these can be done on the actual dyno) in a couple of weeks.
here are some pics of the finished (prototype) product after a fair bit of filing and hand sanding... have sanded more since but you get the picture/s
i was impressed with my brazing and am overall happy with this considering how many it has taken to get right.... it is good enough to work
on monday, they will be chucked in the bike for a bum dyno test then taken out again (so that back to back testing of these can be done on the actual dyno) in a couple of weeks.
here are some pics of the finished (prototype) product after a fair bit of filing and hand sanding... have sanded more since but you get the picture/s
Post 73 by Colonel_Klinck,
#73Nice one dude. You think they are going to work well with Motobox? Can't wait to see results!
Post 74 by indy84,
#74Nice bit of work with the stacks, The results will be interesting.
The black fork leg lowers look great on the bike with the WP and BREMBO standing out.
The black fork leg lowers look great on the bike with the WP and BREMBO standing out.
Post 75 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 76 by MrZ32,
#76And thanks Indy for the engine hoist beer and food... Let me know when you are doing yours... Happy to help
Post 77 by MrZ32,
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Post 78 by preey,
#78LOOKING GOOD ive been holding back from fitting my moto box so i could do every thing in one go
Post 79 by MrZ32,
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Post 80 by Bert,
#80Looking good James!
I'm curious about the dyno results.
I'm curious about the dyno results.
Post 81 by preey,
#81OK I WILL DIG THE MOTO BOX OUT
I was just wondering about the warranty with the bike but ive just rung my local dealers up and he says the warranty will still stand i dont have to change it every time it goes in on a service but if out goes tits up then i need to put the standard one back in
so looks like im fitting it this wk end
I was just wondering about the warranty with the bike but ive just rung my local dealers up and he says the warranty will still stand i dont have to change it every time it goes in on a service but if out goes tits up then i need to put the standard one back in
so looks like im fitting it this wk end
Post 82 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 83 by Linga,
#83Sounds awesome matie, I'd definately buy a pair if they do as promised. Midrange torque rocks all the time. I also ride around 120-180kms a day when I'm home if you are looking for a real world tester, but in W.A. though
Post 84 by MrZ32,
#84i just found two other velocity stacks that were sitting in the box that i collected when i picked mine up after finishing them (they are minus the locating fins)... they are slightly shorter but should work the same (probably to a slightly lesser degree).
so i will give them to indy84 (he has a work shop where he can fit those and lives 5 mins away)... so you wont just have to take my word for it.
Indy has a motobox so we can see how well they will fit in the most shallow airbox.
so i will give them to indy84 (he has a work shop where he can fit those and lives 5 mins away)... so you wont just have to take my word for it.
Indy has a motobox so we can see how well they will fit in the most shallow airbox.
Post 85 by MrZ32,
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Post 86 by Colonel_Klinck,
#86Cheers m8
Post 87 by MrZ32,
#87i will chuck them in tomorrow morning for a quick blat to see how they go... and check to see if my tolerances inside the box are correct
Post 88 by MrZ32,
#88ok so i installed them... here are the pics... note the white dots that have been used to line up the fins with the throttle body shafts so that the main fins are parallel with the shafts. Was around 10mm of clearance from the top of the dvs lip to the roof of the airbox (shows my measuring was pretty close), so the clearance in good.
first impressions... as expected, partial throttle response was much better and rolling on much better but unfortunately just had a big downpour before i got out on the bike so i couldnt really get a chance to give it the beans. But i will let you know shortly
I will let you know shortly what i think about them.
first impressions... as expected, partial throttle response was much better and rolling on much better but unfortunately just had a big downpour before i got out on the bike so i couldnt really get a chance to give it the beans. But i will let you know shortly
I will let you know shortly what i think about them.
Post 89 by Colonel_Klinck,
#89So close to the end! Can't wait to see what the dyno says. Prepare for a mass order on here if it shows positive figures.
Post 90 by MrZ32,
#90as you know i took those dvs' for a run about a week ago... and wasnt overly impressed (could tell it was wanting to work but not quite)
i knew straight away what it was... throttle intakes are on an angle and i didnt account for that. I made a couple of very simple mods (shortened the bottom part of the DVS), took it for a run and all i can say is f*ck me...it is freeking stupid now. So much power... slightly more from 4g and once 5 hits it goes mental. And bogging down on full throttle at lower rpms has been eliminated.
all i can say is im very happy and am looking forward to seeing the results on the dyno shortly.
to give you an idea it was still wanting to lift the front in the air in fourth under power (no clutch)
BTW guys... who would be interested if had some custom aluminium oil catch cans made up designed to fit the sd? (was thinking of mounting the off the mounts left over after removing 2ndry throttle motor).
i knew straight away what it was... throttle intakes are on an angle and i didnt account for that. I made a couple of very simple mods (shortened the bottom part of the DVS), took it for a run and all i can say is f*ck me...it is freeking stupid now. So much power... slightly more from 4g and once 5 hits it goes mental. And bogging down on full throttle at lower rpms has been eliminated.
all i can say is im very happy and am looking forward to seeing the results on the dyno shortly.
to give you an idea it was still wanting to lift the front in the air in fourth under power (no clutch)
BTW guys... who would be interested if had some custom aluminium oil catch cans made up designed to fit the sd? (was thinking of mounting the off the mounts left over after removing 2ndry throttle motor).
Post 91 by Willh,
#91Glad to here it's working. I'm interested. As for the catch can would have to see it. I'm guessing your not going to breathe case pressure into the airbox.
Post 92 by MrZ32,
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Post 93 by Lowrance,
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Post 96 by Colonel_Klinck,
#96This is awesome news James Any ideas on shipping dates and prices if dyno backs up butt dyno?
Could also be interested in catch can. Breather going into my Motobox tends to make a right mess of filter and throttle bodies. When being raped she does chuck some oil up through there.
Could also be interested in catch can. Breather going into my Motobox tends to make a right mess of filter and throttle bodies. When being raped she does chuck some oil up through there.
Post 97 by MrZ32,
#97Good stuff James.Would adding some height and a more rounded lip to the original plastic dvs do the same job or do you need a smaller diameter to increase flow.Also would a one way valve to the catch can help with crankcase breathing.Cheers.Give us a ring.I lost your number.)
Post 98 by MrZ32,
#98well now with the slightly shorter length... material costs should be cheaper.
I am looking into giving people two options... either a oil/temperature resistant nyoln version or aluminium both would be billet (machined from the one piece), with obviously the plastic one being cheaper
I am looking into giving people two options... either a oil/temperature resistant nyoln version or aluminium both would be billet (machined from the one piece), with obviously the plastic one being cheaper
Post 99 by loony888,
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Post 100 by MrZ32,
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Post 101 by loony888,
#101you are correct... a dyno run needs to be carried out. Then another with the lip design that i always wanted (but that will be made after initial dyno testing)
it will not be sold without extensive testing and dyno charts to prove it... and i am glad that there are cynics. That keeps it all honest.
as for lifting the front wheel... it is not coming way up but its lifting off the ground in 4th.
however it used to do this with guys map (dont use this as it is way too lean though)... this is a bike that with just an akra map (before the tuneECU days), the grimbox and the custom termi's was putting out 121whp (done at the team moto opening of the virginia triumph shop)
indy84 will be testing these too as he has my spare set that were made.
as for the map i am currently running it is a combo of rallsies and otto's.. whichever was the higher value of advance was used (was happy to use ottos as i always have used it without any issues).
the map used to run too rich for my bike until the dvs was put in place... it runs well now
it will not be sold without extensive testing and dyno charts to prove it... and i am glad that there are cynics. That keeps it all honest.
as for lifting the front wheel... it is not coming way up but its lifting off the ground in 4th.
however it used to do this with guys map (dont use this as it is way too lean though)... this is a bike that with just an akra map (before the tuneECU days), the grimbox and the custom termi's was putting out 121whp (done at the team moto opening of the virginia triumph shop)
indy84 will be testing these too as he has my spare set that were made.
as for the map i am currently running it is a combo of rallsies and otto's.. whichever was the higher value of advance was used (was happy to use ottos as i always have used it without any issues).
the map used to run too rich for my bike until the dvs was put in place... it runs well now
Post 102 by MrZ32,
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Post 103 by loony888,
#103the issue with the standard flies is that adds to the very on off throttle as well as creating horrible turbulence with anything but 100% openings... even then the shaft is not very aerodynamic... it is about trying to speed up airflow in a positive way.
as for running no flies or shafts... i much prefer it to having the flies... but you will get to test it all out for yourself when you finish your beast.
havent seen any updates lately... hows it all coming along? far to go?
as for running no flies or shafts... i much prefer it to having the flies... but you will get to test it all out for yourself when you finish your beast.
havent seen any updates lately... hows it all coming along? far to go?
Post 104 by MrZ32,
#104still waiting for paul to ring me about my suspension
i have ordered a set of braketech rotors though and the rear is ready to bolt on once there's a shock in there, with the forks in and the wheels on i can get it off the stand and get the exhaust and battery box assembly on then i'm just waiting for a tank.....
i have ordered a set of braketech rotors though and the rear is ready to bolt on once there's a shock in there, with the forks in and the wheels on i can get it off the stand and get the exhaust and battery box assembly on then i'm just waiting for a tank.....
Post 105 by loony888,
#105Has someone got a CFD package at work, that would be useful to run comparison designs?
Post 106 by MrZ32,
#106Man that is taking some serious time to coat... Why so long?
Post 107 by indy84,
#107the rear shock body needed black passivate coating and i think paul forgot about it, it's cool, not like i need it to ride.
paul.
paul.
Post 108 by loony888,
#108I saw an 07 tank for sale on eBay last night.. 422 Dollars
Post 109 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 110 by indy84,
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Post 111 by indy84,
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Post 112 by MrZ32,
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Post 113 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 114 by MrZ32,
#114Well I'm confident that it makes a noticeable amount of torque... I'm glad you liked the grunt Indy. Unfortunately until its run on a dyno back to back... I have no proof. I am looking forward to sharing the results with you guys shortly. I have the NC file being quoted on.
I will let you know how the pricing comes along... You can then decide if its worth the money or not
I will let you know how the pricing comes along... You can then decide if its worth the money or not
Post 115 by Colonel_Klinck,
#115When is the dyno time happening dude?
Post 116 by Wier,
#116After the gazillion public holidays that we have had lately, court appearances (fighting speeding fine that i didnt do), Uni assignments and Uni itself I am skint of both time and money for at least another fortnight. Oh yeah and service costs (big 30k km for SD and 12k for hypermotard at roughly 1g each... extorsion)
However, I will try to do the dyno run sometime soon. As this is something important that I know some of you are hanging out for.
If I have any free money left by this weekend i will try and organise something.
However, I will try to do the dyno run sometime soon. As this is something important that I know some of you are hanging out for.
If I have any free money left by this weekend i will try and organise something.
Post 117 by MrZ32,
#117Wier... Next time your out samford way let me know... IV got a good map I can load on for you
Post 118 by Wier,
#118Sweet! I shall let you know!
Post 119 by indy84,
#119- phone 069.jpg (29.28 KiB) Viewed 8158 times
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So i rode over Mt. nebo down to samford, got more fuel and went back over Mt. nebo (closest mountain ride to me)
Definitely more power... i was rolling the power on through all the gears, up hills and trying to get a good feel of the tourque curve. I was doing standing starts on the straights to test acceleration... really strong power.
but there is a flat spot from about 7000 to 8500 rpm then it starts accelerating hard again till red line, that should be able to be tuned out of it e.g. more advance or more fuel.
Id like to increase the rev limiter.
Side notes - a very cool wistle on deceleration that wasent there b4, also more popping on decel (but not as much as b4 the motobox).
-there is more engine braking, there will be a theory behind it`(i was sliding into a corner at a 45 degree angle on engine braking)
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So now is the time for the dyno, im also a fan of taking the bike to the drag strip to see the 1/4 mile time.
Post 120 by MrZ32,
#120So I assume that you like them.. You really can feel the loan down and mid range jump hugely in torque.
The flat spot I haven't had but when we have a look at the air fuel ratio next weekend we can find out why its there. I will have a look at your map and see if there is a richening or leaning out at that rpm. Once proven on a dyno, wait and see what the new machined ones will be like with the correct lip design (not just close enough like at the moment)
The flat spot I haven't had but when we have a look at the air fuel ratio next weekend we can find out why its there. I will have a look at your map and see if there is a richening or leaning out at that rpm. Once proven on a dyno, wait and see what the new machined ones will be like with the correct lip design (not just close enough like at the moment)
Post 121 by MrZ32,
#121was talking to a friend of mine who makes carbon fibre parts, i asked him about making the DVS pieces... he replied by showing me the intake trumpets that he makes for the stone bothers racing team... and all the other pannels and parts that he makes for the V8 super cars and redbull f1 team.
how does only 50grams sound for the pair as opposed to ~300g
and surprisingly cheap to have made (read a lot less expensive than machining, yet still get to achieve the correct lip design)... only need to have one initial piece machined for a molding. The fins would then need to be attached as a separate thing but easily done.
Indy and I are off to do dyno testing very shortly (within 2 weeks). When proven to work I will put an order through for the carbon fibre ones.... James
how does only 50grams sound for the pair as opposed to ~300g
and surprisingly cheap to have made (read a lot less expensive than machining, yet still get to achieve the correct lip design)... only need to have one initial piece machined for a molding. The fins would then need to be attached as a separate thing but easily done.
Indy and I are off to do dyno testing very shortly (within 2 weeks). When proven to work I will put an order through for the carbon fibre ones.... James
Post 122 by MrZ32,
#122this was after showing me the grass hockey stick that he had just made... with his name in the top layer of the weave. 10layers thick (most structural items are only 3). It was taken from his original stick and modified for his height. He made it on a friday afternoon... and it was flawless. His work is truly incredible... all high end autoclaved pieces.
Post 123 by Colonel_Klinck,
#123Can't wait to see the dyno results.
Post 124 by jaanusj,
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Post 125 by loony888,
#125i have carbon fibre intake trumpets on my 888 and they have been there for over 10 years with no issues, as long as they're a quality part they will be fine.
paul.
paul.
Post 126 by MrZ32,
#126as loony said, cf (if of a good quality) is absolutely fine... and super stong, even at .5mm thick.
Here is a pic of intake trumpets for the Stone Brothers Racing team with the injector mounts attached... this was what my mate made. Turns out that my calcs put me within .5mm of the radius that the SBR team uses for the lip design.
( http://www.stonebrothersracing.com.au/Default.asp )
Here is a pic of intake trumpets for the Stone Brothers Racing team with the injector mounts attached... this was what my mate made. Turns out that my calcs put me within .5mm of the radius that the SBR team uses for the lip design.
( http://www.stonebrothersracing.com.au/Default.asp )
Post 127 by preey,
#127they do look nice
Post 128 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 129 by 2bigalow,
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Post 130 by MrZ32,
#130price... well it requires me to machine up two molds for the actual trumpet (formed as one piece) then attaching of fins after (have some clever ideas for this)... all carbon. It is possible to make them as one piece with the fins attached but would astronomically increase the price.
My mate said he is happy to attach the fins but said that he would just give me a few big offcuts to make the fins out of (to make it cheaper and faster)... use a special resin and done. So I cant quite do it at a total hands off role cheap enough (which is what i normally do... come up with the design and procure it out to someone else and annoy them like buggery until it happens)
if i do it in a more involved mannor (after tooling up... prob another 600 bucks ) i can get hold of them at a physical cost of about 60-90 bucks a pair (before i touch them)... its gonna be a real labour of love this one when/if I get a chance to make it happen. I guess it will come down to how many people will want them once the figures are proven (so they can do their own hp/$ analysis). Obviously the more made it will be cheaper.
will have to talk to indy84 to get hold of his machining shop now... the MK2 model will be free for you too if you can help out with the machining of the molds
My mate said he is happy to attach the fins but said that he would just give me a few big offcuts to make the fins out of (to make it cheaper and faster)... use a special resin and done. So I cant quite do it at a total hands off role cheap enough (which is what i normally do... come up with the design and procure it out to someone else and annoy them like buggery until it happens)
if i do it in a more involved mannor (after tooling up... prob another 600 bucks ) i can get hold of them at a physical cost of about 60-90 bucks a pair (before i touch them)... its gonna be a real labour of love this one when/if I get a chance to make it happen. I guess it will come down to how many people will want them once the figures are proven (so they can do their own hp/$ analysis). Obviously the more made it will be cheaper.
will have to talk to indy84 to get hold of his machining shop now... the MK2 model will be free for you too if you can help out with the machining of the molds
Post 131 by Colonel_Klinck,
#131cool. Guess it will all come down to £/HP gained equation in the end.
Post 132 by Twisted Jester,
#132Those carbon trumpets definitely look the part don't they
Post 133 by MrZ32,
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Post 134 by MrZ32,
#134well my other design that i was wanting to test for the dyno day has just been made... now to attach the fins
this design is a shorter one and slightly smaller...
so both my designs will be tested when indy and i do the dyno day... then whichever one works will then be done with the lip design that I really want... made in carbon but will require to molds to be made for the one piece.
this design is a shorter one and slightly smaller...
so both my designs will be tested when indy and i do the dyno day... then whichever one works will then be done with the lip design that I really want... made in carbon but will require to molds to be made for the one piece.
Post 135 by SDtaxi,
#135Nice! Very curious for the results with the two designs
Post 136 by Colonel_Klinck,
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Post 137 by indy84,
#137Looks great mate, let me know when your putting them in and ill head ova
Post 138 by Linga,
#138They look awesome matie! I'm hanging to see the results.
If you have spare time I'd love to know why you have gone with the one inside the other as opposed to a complete new one.
If you have spare time I'd love to know why you have gone with the one inside the other as opposed to a complete new one.
Post 139 by cdlabate,
#139This thread is much to long to not have any results yet. C'mon, I want to spend my monnies already.
Post 140 by MrZ32,
#140problem is i either have time or money... never both
Post 141 by indy84,
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Post 142 by joey120373,
#142Ok, I know that progress has stalled on this a bit due to some unfortunate events, but as i understand it there are 2 SD's with these mounted right? could we get an update? a dyno chart possibly? heck, i would be willing to buy a set and test them myself just to see what would happen. there was another forum member that did something similar to this with similar results i remember reading about a couple of years back or so. So i think that the mod is probably viable, but proof would be nice!
I remember when an air box similar to the motohooligan design (same concept but flat top and bottom) came out, there were quite a few naysayers, but now the motohooligan box is a must have.
I remember when an air box similar to the motohooligan design (same concept but flat top and bottom) came out, there were quite a few naysayers, but now the motohooligan box is a must have.
Post 143 by Stratkat,
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Post 144 by MrZ32,
#144unfortunately just before the testing began I was hit by a car... Bike is still being repaired and due to useless qbe insurance and even more hopeless ktm Australia... My bike will be out for prob 4-5months in total. However I will talk with Indy and get him to try out the first set of carbon fibre dvs' which I have sitting at home.
Post 145 by Agent Orange,
#145Hi,
that really sucks to hear mate, hope you're ok.
What's the issue with QBE?
that really sucks to hear mate, hope you're ok.
What's the issue with QBE?
Post 146 by MrZ32,
#146first of all it was not my fault and the other persons insurance is paying (prob is that they are qbe too), they keep on knocking things back that need to be replaced (t-boned the car and wrote it off), trying to tell me that things are safe and fully backed when the have not even tested nor will provide engineering certificates for straight forks/chassis or metal defects. I will put up with it no longer and will start pulling out the procedures that I have to go through with designing and having items built for the engineering firm that i am in.
They then got upset, blamed the the first company for not wanting to be 'reasonable' with the price(because they wanted to make sure that the frame was straight, test the forks/triples for defects and do the job properly as they know me), so they then sent the bike to team homo (without telling me) who were happy to do it for cheaper (i.e. cut corners).
To give you an idea, i hit the car so hard that the rim is well and truly out of shape and they are replacing it, however they wont replace the fairly new tyre... they want to put the old tyre that has discolored due to being pushed out of shape, the list goes on with what the assessor will not approve.
I have a good mind to put some of my contract engineers onto the assessor and prove to qbe and the ombudsman that he is either incompetent or negligent. I was being nice and letting them do their job, but i have my doubts with these guys.
They should have given me the bike and money, I would have gotten it done faster, cheaper and better with all the test certificate to prove that it is safe not a (its all good we back it, look we signed it, you're fine now). I dont care if you think its fine, I want you to be able to prove it.
However QBE will learn very quickly that they should not have tried to screw me around/over, oh and I am going to start spreading the word to those in the biking comunity of the facts of how QBE has dealt with me.
They then got upset, blamed the the first company for not wanting to be 'reasonable' with the price(because they wanted to make sure that the frame was straight, test the forks/triples for defects and do the job properly as they know me), so they then sent the bike to team homo (without telling me) who were happy to do it for cheaper (i.e. cut corners).
To give you an idea, i hit the car so hard that the rim is well and truly out of shape and they are replacing it, however they wont replace the fairly new tyre... they want to put the old tyre that has discolored due to being pushed out of shape, the list goes on with what the assessor will not approve.
I have a good mind to put some of my contract engineers onto the assessor and prove to qbe and the ombudsman that he is either incompetent or negligent. I was being nice and letting them do their job, but i have my doubts with these guys.
They should have given me the bike and money, I would have gotten it done faster, cheaper and better with all the test certificate to prove that it is safe not a (its all good we back it, look we signed it, you're fine now). I dont care if you think its fine, I want you to be able to prove it.
However QBE will learn very quickly that they should not have tried to screw me around/over, oh and I am going to start spreading the word to those in the biking comunity of the facts of how QBE has dealt with me.
Post 147 by tripoddave,
#147I can't believe they wanted to reuse the original tyre. That's madness!
Is Oz law so very different from ours? If you ask for things to be done, your insurance company refuses and you are killed as a result of a component failure the QBE board could be tried for corporate manslaughter and go to jail for up to 20years in the UK. Insurance companies are very risk averse here.
Is Oz law so very different from ours? If you ask for things to be done, your insurance company refuses and you are killed as a result of a component failure the QBE board could be tried for corporate manslaughter and go to jail for up to 20years in the UK. Insurance companies are very risk averse here.
Post 148 by MrZ32,
#148My exact sentiments tripod. But I would rather nor crash and die to show them that they are wrong
Post 149 by One67,
#149WHAT!!, they want to use the same tyre???.
When tyres get hit that hard, the belts delaminate and then it's only a matter of time before they
"baloon" or worse.
Those clowns give retards a bad name.
When tyres get hit that hard, the belts delaminate and then it's only a matter of time before they
"baloon" or worse.
Those clowns give retards a bad name.
Post 150 by MrZ32,
#150That's what I said. And they won't test the forks, triples or head stock for straightness or defects as it is not approved by the incompetent or negligent assessor.
Do not use qbe insurance unless you want a bodgy repair.
Do not use qbe insurance unless you want a bodgy repair.
Post 151 by AGRO!,
#151I've heard all this before about QBE. They use second hand parts and will put some of the old parts back on that have damage and claim that this would be normal wear and tear going off the bikes mileage. They are crap so don't get suck in.
Post 152 by MrZ32,
#152You should also set-up a local facebook group, mentioning your and others 'opinions'.
Post 153 by AGRO!,
#153I think I am the only 25yr old without Facebook.. I plan on keeping it that way also. But I do catch up with a lot of people regularly who can help spread the word
Post 154 by TLS_Russ,
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Post 155 by MrZ32,
#155+1
Post 156 by Linga,
#156I don't disagree, I dont have 400 friends. But, the 'groups' are very visible and can be quite effective consumer action.
Post 157 by joey120373,
#157well gezza or anyone with face book, if you want to put this issue with QBE Motorcycle Insurance, I would much obliged... James
Post 158 by Linga,
#158If you really want to stick it to them, australian insurance legislation states that a repair must be done at a "reasonable price." as long as you can prove it ie. Certs from engineers, the negligent party is 100% liable for all costs. The three quotes thing and letting someone else, including your own insurance company, choose repairer/amount of repair is a common misnomer spread by these companies. You will be backed fully by the ombudsman and the ACCC.
Post 159 by MrZ32,
#159http://www.velocity-of-sound.com/
These are not cheep. but not horribly expensive either, I am considering ordering a couple, 50mm ID x 70mm length are about $35usd each. I would of course prefer to buy a set of tested and proven carbon fibre units (hint hint )
These are not cheep. but not horribly expensive either, I am considering ordering a couple, 50mm ID x 70mm length are about $35usd each. I would of course prefer to buy a set of tested and proven carbon fibre units (hint hint )
Post 160 by MrZ32,
#160G'day Mr Z32,
I was reading in your earlier posts that there wasn't enough room in the Airbox for you to put in the correct length of stack that you wanted.
I was wondering what the optimal length of stack would be if the Air box wasn't an issue eg, a GoGo style box using the underside of the tank as the top of the box?
I was reading in your earlier posts that there wasn't enough room in the Airbox for you to put in the correct length of stack that you wanted.
I was wondering what the optimal length of stack would be if the Air box wasn't an issue eg, a GoGo style box using the underside of the tank as the top of the box?
Post 161 by indy84,
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Post 162 by MrZ32,
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Post 163 by MrZ32,
#163
will be ready by the weekend... indy... wanna give them a try when they are done (dont have a bike atm)
Post 164 by nampus,
#164Looks promising! Very curious about the results of these.
Any idea what the price is gonna be for a set?
Any idea what the price is gonna be for a set?
Post 165 by MrZ32,
#165the DVS's i can have made fairly cheap... i may make them so they are already pre-assembled into a ktm velocity stack so you know they are right (all glued in) so it will be as simple as twisting the old ones out and swapping with the new... cost to me is around 50+ 35 (80) bucks (and lots of time until i can streamline the process) i would think (unless we got a core swap thing happening).
the machined items... well i may end up sending that over to motohooligan once done as machining costs a lot more over in oz than it does in the states... wouldnt imagine that the machined stacks would be cheap though... as a lot of material is used (read wasted) to get to that point... at a guess, half the price of a motobox... but heres the good part, they could be shipped individually to miss import taxes?
the machined items... well i may end up sending that over to motohooligan once done as machining costs a lot more over in oz than it does in the states... wouldnt imagine that the machined stacks would be cheap though... as a lot of material is used (read wasted) to get to that point... at a guess, half the price of a motobox... but heres the good part, they could be shipped individually to miss import taxes?
Post 166 by nampus,
#166Thanks! I really admire all the time and effort you put in to this!
Keep it up!
Keep it up!
Post 167 by Crotchrockety,
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Post 168 by MrZ32,
#168model was given to the machinests at uni,the prototypes should be ready in about two weeks (for the replacement for the stock intake).. not the DVS'
Post 169 by MrZ32,
#169well they are now made up and will be finished tonight... they will be bonded into the standard stacks permanently for extra strength
Indy... come and grab them tomorrow if you want
Indy... come and grab them tomorrow if you want
Post 170 by Colonel_Klinck,
#170You can count me in.I am not a top end guy I like mid and low end.I ride with friends that have much faster bikes top end wise.They got 40 mph always blow by me on long straights.I always get them back in the tight stuff so I need that kind of power low and mid range when I need the power right now.It will we interesting on the tracks that don't have long high top end straights. Keep me posted I love to mess around stuff like that.
Post 171 by kowekiller,
#171Can't wait to see some dyno figures. Although don't really fancy paying for mine to hit the dyno twice in 12 months.
Post 172 by kowekiller,
#172Is there a different way to make those float in the other stack? If those fins fall off your pretty much screwed. Im interested to see what these will do. Do you think this will rob top end?
Post 173 by MrZ32,
#173You making a Carbon airbox like the DNA STAGE 3"? IM IN..
Post 174 by MrZ32,
#174Post missing
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Post 175 by MrZ32,
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Post 176 by indy84,
#176getting closer now
Post 177 by Linga,
#177Fark... they look awesome
Post 178 by kowekiller,
#178Awesome! I definitely need a set!
Post 179 by kevxtx,
#179Sexy....I wanna put my DUKE in them.
Post 180 by MrZ32,
#180Looking good mate.
Post 181 by Bert,
#181ok i picked them up, i have ditched the standard twist lock for a keeper plate design (as it was a favour, and the rest would have required a lot of extra time which they did not have).
i will fit them either this weekend or tonight (unlikely though for tonight).
they are beautiful.. and I cannot wait to run all these different mods on the dyno after my exams.
on a totally off topic subject... for those who are mechanically minded check this out (note that even on the upwards stroke of the conrod the there is power being applied to the usually 'dead' stroke)
this has actually been made and put into a ducati.
i will fit them either this weekend or tonight (unlikely though for tonight).
they are beautiful.. and I cannot wait to run all these different mods on the dyno after my exams.
on a totally off topic subject... for those who are mechanically minded check this out (note that even on the upwards stroke of the conrod the there is power being applied to the usually 'dead' stroke)
this has actually been made and put into a ducati.
Post 182 by AGRO!,
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Post 183 by MrZ32,
#183I wonder how reliable that system is Seem like a good idea at the time
Post 184 by Bermo KTM,
#184does anyone in brisbane want to try these out?
i will need them back for the dyno testing this summer but they only take 10mins to fit or pull out.
i will need them back for the dyno testing this summer but they only take 10mins to fit or pull out.
Post 185 by MrZ32,
#18510 mins ??? i wish you worked in my KTM garage
Post 186 by Jermo,
#186Practice makes perfect. All it is is 10 bolts on my bike or 12 with a motobox. I have a ratchet t handle that makes short work of everything. Just ask Indy how much I love that thing. Lol
Post 187 by Linga,
#187Looking forward to the dyno results!
Post 188 by MrZ32,
#188Post missing
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Post 189 by Linga,
#189Motobox on both, but the SDR is still a few weeks away.
I'll be taking the trusty old girl around to see if I can pick up some pace.
I'll be taking the trusty old girl around to see if I can pick up some pace.
Post 190 by MrZ32,
#190after the 16th i will finish my machined up intakes and air bag them over for your track day... but i will be wanting them back after.
or i could send you the DWG's to get some machined up over there (would prefer this one, will do them up as PDF's). The DVS' i dont think are what you want as i think they are more suited the street... what you want is as much HP as possible.
we could even experiment with shortening the intake (for the time being before i start seriously looking at variable length intakes). Do you know any fitter & turners near you that If given drawings could knock up? If the twist lock system is ditched it can all be done an a lathe (easy and cheap)
Guessing that you will be wanting one of the swingarm braces when im done?
or i could send you the DWG's to get some machined up over there (would prefer this one, will do them up as PDF's). The DVS' i dont think are what you want as i think they are more suited the street... what you want is as much HP as possible.
we could even experiment with shortening the intake (for the time being before i start seriously looking at variable length intakes). Do you know any fitter & turners near you that If given drawings could knock up? If the twist lock system is ditched it can all be done an a lathe (easy and cheap)
Guessing that you will be wanting one of the swingarm braces when im done?
Post 191 by kevxtx,
#191Post missing
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Post 192 by MrZ32,
#192Post missing
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Post 193 by MrZ32,
#193delete
Post 194 by kevxtx,
#194Post missing
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Post 195 by MrZ32,
#195I will be here Sat Morning... Heck if you want, feel free to try all 3 designs i have. When/where do you plan on testing these... Might even take some time off from work come along
Post 196 by kevxtx,
#196Post missing
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Post 197 by kevxtx,
#197I should be good for Sat morning if you still want me to dyno test the mod for you, it is a 3 hour round trip for me so would come early, should be there around 800am, can you PM me your address & we can exchange mobile numbers. If you can't make Sat that is no problem, I will be back on the dyno in a few weeks again if you still want the mod tested.
I work in Newstead, if you work close by I could pick them up from you tomorrow or Friday.
I work in Newstead, if you work close by I could pick them up from you tomorrow or Friday.
Post 198 by MrZ32,
#198Post missing
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Post 199 by Anata,
#199Watching and waiting with intent! They look tasty even if you rarely see them. What's the weight difference over standard? 200g +/- ?
Post 200 by kowekiller,
#200Post missing
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Post 201 by kowekiller,
#201You going to run a taller filter? You wanna make another box?
Post 202 by kevxtx,
#202Are you using the throttle bodies lugs to mount the new stacks? I can't see clearly but it looks like they are bolted down.
My throttle body tops.
Looking at your photo's I am not sure if the new stacks will clear the left lower DNA air box bolt & air filter, what do you think, can you PM me the outer diameter so I can check to see if it will clear, I would hate to ride all the way to you & it won't fit? Also your air box is much better suited with better air flow around the stack with it being off set compared to the DNA air box.
My throttle body tops.
Looking at your photo's I am not sure if the new stacks will clear the left lower DNA air box bolt & air filter, what do you think, can you PM me the outer diameter so I can check to see if it will clear, I would hate to ride all the way to you & it won't fit? Also your air box is much better suited with better air flow around the stack with it being off set compared to the DNA air box.
Post 203 by MrZ32,
#203Post missing
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Post 204 by kevxtx,
#204Let me know if you can get the machining done today otherwise I can test them at a later date. It is a bit to late for me to pull my tank off tonight (Friday night) as I am out for dinner tonight to measure the 94mm.
Can you PM me you address & mobile number.
Can you PM me you address & mobile number.
Post 205 by kevxtx,
#205I will be passing the servo by you around 930/945am are you able to meet me at that time tomorrow morning?
Post 206 by MrZ32,
#206Yes... Will see u there
can you please pm me your mobile no. Just to make it easier to catch you
can you please pm me your mobile no. Just to make it easier to catch you
Post 207 by kevxtx,
#207PM sent with Mobile, catch up in the morning.
Post 208 by MrZ32,
#208Post missing
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Post 209 by SDNerd,
#20913 Months. 9 Pages (200+ posts). I just read all of them. At least, I'm pretty sure I did.
But, I'm not sure why. I feel like I missed something. Lot's of interesting ideas, some nice pictures of pretty hardware - all good.
Did I just miss a page or something, where there are beautiful dyno plots showing improvements throughout the power band - ? Seems an awful lot of energy spent for bling and butt-dyno proclamations. There sure is a lot of cart in front of this horse ... As a fellow engineer (not civil), I tend to live and die by test results.
On the possibility I didn't overlook "the numbers" - as in, they don't exist - Is everyone (anyone?) game to PayPal this poor SOB a couple of bucks to get something - anything - dyno'd?
But, I'm not sure why. I feel like I missed something. Lot's of interesting ideas, some nice pictures of pretty hardware - all good.
Did I just miss a page or something, where there are beautiful dyno plots showing improvements throughout the power band - ? Seems an awful lot of energy spent for bling and butt-dyno proclamations. There sure is a lot of cart in front of this horse ... As a fellow engineer (not civil), I tend to live and die by test results.
On the possibility I didn't overlook "the numbers" - as in, they don't exist - Is everyone (anyone?) game to PayPal this poor SOB a couple of bucks to get something - anything - dyno'd?
Post 210 by Crotchrockety,
#210Post missing
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Post 211 by MrZ32,
#211Kev is helping me out a bit at the moment. I was about to get dyno testing done 6 months ago but was then hit by a car.. Development went on hold. I only just got my bike back from repairs... So I have started again. So there will be results shortly.
Post 212 by kevxtx,
#212Good to meet you as well James. You might be onto a winner depending on where you want the torque.
I have tested both version this afternoon James still has version 3 on his bike, as mentioned I will be on the Dyno on Monday 21.11.11 & will post the facts.
James I have PM you the Winpep7 program please install it & I will send you the Dyno run files for detailed viewing On Monday.
I have tested both version this afternoon James still has version 3 on his bike, as mentioned I will be on the Dyno on Monday 21.11.11 & will post the facts.
James I have PM you the Winpep7 program please install it & I will send you the Dyno run files for detailed viewing On Monday.
Post 213 by lcjohnny,
#213Such pretty engineering its metal-porn
Now you need a transparent tank and airbox so every one can see
what are the results on dyno?
Now you need a transparent tank and airbox so every one can see
what are the results on dyno?
Post 214 by kevxtx,
#214Ok guys I built a single cylinder tune map for all my mods using Tune Link software with my PCV today.
The mods on my bike for the dyno run.
DNA MK3 air box.
Leovince pipes.
2nd flies & shafts removed.
EPC turned off.
O2 sensors turned off.
Custom PCV map with single cylinder tunning.
I did a final power run then fitted the metal stacks & as the results show the stacks made HP & Torque everywhere. I some places up to 5HP.
The Green run is my final power run after the custom mapping
The Red run is with the metal stacks fitted no map change, we should be able to pick up more HP & Torque below 6000 rpm as the stacks made the bike run around 12:1 below 6000rpm.
Well done James you have done well. I did have a glitch with the fibre stacks & was unable to test them, I have Emailed James the run files, at least James now has something to work from. Also there would be different results with different air boxes so it is still early days, lets hope there is more hidden HP & Torque in this mod. As mentioned to James if he needs Dyno testing I have no problems running my bike on the Dyno for testing any performance mod.
The mods on my bike for the dyno run.
DNA MK3 air box.
Leovince pipes.
2nd flies & shafts removed.
EPC turned off.
O2 sensors turned off.
Custom PCV map with single cylinder tunning.
I did a final power run then fitted the metal stacks & as the results show the stacks made HP & Torque everywhere. I some places up to 5HP.
The Green run is my final power run after the custom mapping
The Red run is with the metal stacks fitted no map change, we should be able to pick up more HP & Torque below 6000 rpm as the stacks made the bike run around 12:1 below 6000rpm.
Well done James you have done well. I did have a glitch with the fibre stacks & was unable to test them, I have Emailed James the run files, at least James now has something to work from. Also there would be different results with different air boxes so it is still early days, lets hope there is more hidden HP & Torque in this mod. As mentioned to James if he needs Dyno testing I have no problems running my bike on the Dyno for testing any performance mod.
Post 215 by Crotchrockety,
#215Very nice. Put me down for a pair.
Post 216 by indy84,
#216YEEHARR.... 10 PAGES WORTH OF RESERCH PAID OFF!!!!!
Post 217 by Reb,
#217Well done James, thats a great result. You da man . I'll get my letter off to Santa tonight. . I think you'll need a manufacturer who can churn them out because I'm sure the demand will be there. Can't wait to see what you come up with for the variable intakes.
Post 218 by AlpineDuke,
#218Great result! Great job, I admire your persistence.
Just out of curiousity, what would the effect be of a triple velocity stack?
Just out of curiousity, what would the effect be of a triple velocity stack?
Post 219 by MrZ32,
#219A MASSIVE THANKS TO KEV for throwing them on the dyno for me.. i think that you have a pair reserved for you. I think the carbon ones have the potential to be better than the metal ones but only time will tell.
once you have moved the column in the DNA airbox, you will have to try my cnc'd stacks... i keep adding fuel higher up and it just keeps pulling harder... i think for overall hp the CNC'd ones will be the best and if you want the mid range you could combine the two. im guessing an overall improvement of 7-8% (possibly more) is possible rather than just 5%. I am getting to the point where the theory is proven but the margins of error in design now need to changed step by step for proven performance (i do not have the capability with the flow software yet to get much better and am running based of certain assumptions which may not be entirely correct).
Like the point that i was not expecting that much extra top end... I was expecting maybe one HP more (something not really measurable as all sorts of factors could throw it out by that much... but 3-5hp more is a measurable difference... i have had a huge smil on my face all day knowing that this is now proven rather than just the butt dyno
once you have moved the column in the DNA airbox, you will have to try my cnc'd stacks... i keep adding fuel higher up and it just keeps pulling harder... i think for overall hp the CNC'd ones will be the best and if you want the mid range you could combine the two. im guessing an overall improvement of 7-8% (possibly more) is possible rather than just 5%. I am getting to the point where the theory is proven but the margins of error in design now need to changed step by step for proven performance (i do not have the capability with the flow software yet to get much better and am running based of certain assumptions which may not be entirely correct).
Like the point that i was not expecting that much extra top end... I was expecting maybe one HP more (something not really measurable as all sorts of factors could throw it out by that much... but 3-5hp more is a measurable difference... i have had a huge smil on my face all day knowing that this is now proven rather than just the butt dyno
Post 220 by KTM666,
#220Kev good test, well done James
Post 221 by MrZ32,
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Post 222 by MrZ32,
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Post 223 by Linga,
#223A mate is CNCing your model up for me now James, I probably won't have time to dyno it. But it'll get a good run on the third. They should be there for me when I get home.
Post 224 by MrZ32,
#224before we get ahead of ourselves we need to prove in in a more common airbox too... like the more confined motobox. If it works in the shallowest of all the airboxes i am onto a winner.
Indy... im going to need to borrow you and your bike for a dyno day... maybe we could book out the dyno for the day
Indy... im going to need to borrow you and your bike for a dyno day... maybe we could book out the dyno for the day
Post 225 by MrZ32,
#225Post missing
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Post 226 by Linga,
#226Yeah its the twist lock pair. I flung them to my cousin who is a machinist and he's got one of his mates to help me. I'm not sure on cost though, hoping pretty good mates rates.
Who knows, I may just get excited and get it dyno'd if I have the time, but I doubt it.
Who knows, I may just get excited and get it dyno'd if I have the time, but I doubt it.
Post 227 by indy84,
#227wow this looks impressive
would these also fit into the standard Airbox ? I know that others are better, but noise gets the cops close real quick over here.
Any plans when they would be up for purchase ?
would these also fit into the standard Airbox ? I know that others are better, but noise gets the cops close real quick over here.
Any plans when they would be up for purchase ?
Post 228 by Jermo,
#228Post missing
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Post 229 by kevxtx,
#229Post missing
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Post 230 by indy84,
#230Post missing
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Post 231 by MrZ32,
#231Interesting results and totally the opposite of what I would have expected to happen.
It looks like your stacks are longer and narrower - which should have resulted in peak torque being pushed down the rev range.
Yet you seem to have lost volumetric efficiency below 6k, by the fact that the mixture has gone rich, yet you haven't lost any power, if anything you have gained at these revs !?
The switch at 6k is interesting - just shows if someone could engineer some variable height stacks and use the secondary flies map / motor to control them we could be on for some useful gains at all revs.
It looks like your stacks are longer and narrower - which should have resulted in peak torque being pushed down the rev range.
Yet you seem to have lost volumetric efficiency below 6k, by the fact that the mixture has gone rich, yet you haven't lost any power, if anything you have gained at these revs !?
The switch at 6k is interesting - just shows if someone could engineer some variable height stacks and use the secondary flies map / motor to control them we could be on for some useful gains at all revs.
Post 232 by MrZ32,
#232From all the dyno work that I have done over the years I would suggest that a good custom map is built first so you have a good comparison to work from, if you use a poor A/F to start with the mod results will be poor.
We know the metal stacks works well with the MK3 DNA air box & would like to see what the gains & losses are with a standard & Moto air box, there are a few other things going on with these tacks & the MK3 air box that might be helping get he numbers up, James & I have discussed the points, testing the stacks with the Moto box will answer a few of the unkowns.
I agree with James there is still plenty of testing to be done.
We know the metal stacks works well with the MK3 DNA air box & would like to see what the gains & losses are with a standard & Moto air box, there are a few other things going on with these tacks & the MK3 air box that might be helping get he numbers up, James & I have discussed the points, testing the stacks with the Moto box will answer a few of the unkowns.
I agree with James there is still plenty of testing to be done.
Post 233 by SDNerd,
#233I nominate .... me..... for the motobox stack tests... i have an original metal set... but we will have to see what the carbon ones do
Post 234 by indy84,
#234Post missing
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Post 235 by Ravendark,
#235James forks are off to springwood today so can't see my bike being available for this w/e unfortunately. Still can't get the shock bolt out unfortunately.
Post 236 by MrZ32,
#236Do you think those stacks would work on the RC8 as well?
Post 237 by Ravendark,
#237Well I'm booked in for some dyno time this coming Thursday with Indy. Will have them tuned and different intakes tested including the billet items.
I don't know what the rc8 intakes or airbox look like but if you give me some part numbers I could see if they are the same type used in the sd's. If anyone in bris has an rc8 and wants to let me have a look, it is always a possibility.
I don't know what the rc8 intakes or airbox look like but if you give me some part numbers I could see if they are the same type used in the sd's. If anyone in bris has an rc8 and wants to let me have a look, it is always a possibility.
Post 238 by MrZ32,
#238Air box and throttle boddies are quite similar,
airbox:
1 69006002044 FILTER BOX UPPER PART CPL. 1 78.99
3 69006001000 FILTER BOX LOWER PART 1 27.49
4 69006015000 FILTER ELEMENT 1 24.99
5 69006041060 PROT. GRILL INTAKE SNORKEL R/S 1 3.49
6 69006040060 PROT. GRILL INTAKE SNORKEL L/S 1 3.49
7 69006041000 INTAKE SNORKEL R/S 1 25.49
8 69006040000 INTAKE SNORKEL L/S 1 25.49
9 69006041050 SNORKEL SEALING R/S 1 25.49
10 69006040050 SNORKEL SEALING L/S 1 23.99
11 69006015050 BRACKET F. EFI-PLUG 1 4.99
12 0081050161 EJOT PT SCREW K50X16 1451 10 0.99
13 69006004000 FILTER BOX COVER R/S 2 4.99
14 69006001030 THROTTLE ROPE CHANNEL 1 6.49
15 69007029000 PVC-CLAMP HEYCO 13,9 3379 1 2.49
16 69006001040 PROTECTION SLEEVE FUEL HOSE 1 6.99
17 69006087000 MOLDED HOSE ENGINE BREATHER 1 21.49
18 58431082100 YDNAC-CLAMP 10173 (16MM) 1 0.99
19 0024060206 HH COLLAR SCREW M6X20 2 2.49
20 0081400253 PLASTIC SCREW KA40X25WN1412 8 0.99
21 0017060303 SPECIAL SCREW T60 6X30 8 0.99
22 58031005000 CLAMP YDNAC 10128 12MM 2 2.99
23 60015019001 HOSE NBR 7X11 PER METER X 7.99
24 0025080126 HH COLLAR SCREW M8X12 1 2.49
1 0081500181 SCREW FOR PLASTIC D=5X18 2 0.99
2 61041080000 AMBIENT-AIR TEMPERATURE SENSOR 1 15.99
3 61041085150 RUBBER SUPP. PRESSURE SENS. 3 4.99
4 61041085100 PRESSURE SENSOR 3 117.49
5 61036023100 VACUUM CONECTION 2 10.49
6 60031098001 HOSE 3,2X8,5 PER METER X 11.99
8 61241040000 INTAKE TRUMPET 2 5.49
9 61241001000 THROTTLE BODY CPL. DK52 1 971.49
10 69006001031 SENSOR-RETAIN. PLATE AIRBOX 1 10.99
11 69006001032 HOLDER WIRING HARNESS REAR 1 14.49
12 0081050161 EJOT PT SCREW K50X16 1451 4 0.99
13 61041031200 TIMING CHARGER EFI 1 590.49
14 60039030000 VIBRATION DAMPER DIGITALBOX 2 1.49
15 0021050003 WASHER DIN9021-A 5,3 2 0.49
17 0912040203 AH SCREW DIN 912-M 4X20 2 0.99
18 61041088050 SHIM 4,3X15X1,25MM GALVANIZED 2 0.99
19 61041088000 ROLLOVER SENSOR 1 43.99
20 0024060106 HH COLLAR SCREW M6X10 1 1.99
21 69041088050 HOLDER ROLLOVER SENSOR 1 15.99
22 75041023020 O-RING 3 7.49
23 75041023010 SEAL RING 2 8.49
24 61241023044 INJECTOR CPL. 2 145.99
25 61241013044 FUEL HOSE CPL. 1 113.99
27 61241013060 SCREW SHOULDER 2 5.49
28 61041060040 SCREW FOR SUPPORT STEPPER MOT. 1 3.49
airbox:
1 69006002044 FILTER BOX UPPER PART CPL. 1 78.99
3 69006001000 FILTER BOX LOWER PART 1 27.49
4 69006015000 FILTER ELEMENT 1 24.99
5 69006041060 PROT. GRILL INTAKE SNORKEL R/S 1 3.49
6 69006040060 PROT. GRILL INTAKE SNORKEL L/S 1 3.49
7 69006041000 INTAKE SNORKEL R/S 1 25.49
8 69006040000 INTAKE SNORKEL L/S 1 25.49
9 69006041050 SNORKEL SEALING R/S 1 25.49
10 69006040050 SNORKEL SEALING L/S 1 23.99
11 69006015050 BRACKET F. EFI-PLUG 1 4.99
12 0081050161 EJOT PT SCREW K50X16 1451 10 0.99
13 69006004000 FILTER BOX COVER R/S 2 4.99
14 69006001030 THROTTLE ROPE CHANNEL 1 6.49
15 69007029000 PVC-CLAMP HEYCO 13,9 3379 1 2.49
16 69006001040 PROTECTION SLEEVE FUEL HOSE 1 6.99
17 69006087000 MOLDED HOSE ENGINE BREATHER 1 21.49
18 58431082100 YDNAC-CLAMP 10173 (16MM) 1 0.99
19 0024060206 HH COLLAR SCREW M6X20 2 2.49
20 0081400253 PLASTIC SCREW KA40X25WN1412 8 0.99
21 0017060303 SPECIAL SCREW T60 6X30 8 0.99
22 58031005000 CLAMP YDNAC 10128 12MM 2 2.99
23 60015019001 HOSE NBR 7X11 PER METER X 7.99
24 0025080126 HH COLLAR SCREW M8X12 1 2.49
1 0081500181 SCREW FOR PLASTIC D=5X18 2 0.99
2 61041080000 AMBIENT-AIR TEMPERATURE SENSOR 1 15.99
3 61041085150 RUBBER SUPP. PRESSURE SENS. 3 4.99
4 61041085100 PRESSURE SENSOR 3 117.49
5 61036023100 VACUUM CONECTION 2 10.49
6 60031098001 HOSE 3,2X8,5 PER METER X 11.99
8 61241040000 INTAKE TRUMPET 2 5.49
9 61241001000 THROTTLE BODY CPL. DK52 1 971.49
10 69006001031 SENSOR-RETAIN. PLATE AIRBOX 1 10.99
11 69006001032 HOLDER WIRING HARNESS REAR 1 14.49
12 0081050161 EJOT PT SCREW K50X16 1451 4 0.99
13 61041031200 TIMING CHARGER EFI 1 590.49
14 60039030000 VIBRATION DAMPER DIGITALBOX 2 1.49
15 0021050003 WASHER DIN9021-A 5,3 2 0.49
17 0912040203 AH SCREW DIN 912-M 4X20 2 0.99
18 61041088050 SHIM 4,3X15X1,25MM GALVANIZED 2 0.99
19 61041088000 ROLLOVER SENSOR 1 43.99
20 0024060106 HH COLLAR SCREW M6X10 1 1.99
21 69041088050 HOLDER ROLLOVER SENSOR 1 15.99
22 75041023020 O-RING 3 7.49
23 75041023010 SEAL RING 2 8.49
24 61241023044 INJECTOR CPL. 2 145.99
25 61241013044 FUEL HOSE CPL. 1 113.99
27 61241013060 SCREW SHOULDER 2 5.49
28 61041060040 SCREW FOR SUPPORT STEPPER MOT. 1 3.49
Post 239 by Ravendark,
#239stacks and airbox look very different. If I gave you a sketch with dimensions that you need to add would you be able to have a look? Obviously I need to get the SD ones off the ground first but it is possible.
Post 240 by Jermo,
#240Yes I guess I could do it the week after the 3rd of december as I am quite busy right now...
Post 241 by Jermo,
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Post 242 by TLS_Russ,
#242Post missing
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Post 243 by MrZ32,
#243Post missing
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Post 244 by MrZ32,
#244If you have a standard airbox, you will get bigger gains by either going to the pods or putting a propper inlet/ram air setup on the snorkel as that is the big limiting factor on those.
Once the airbox can flow more, then the velocity stacks become the limiting factor
Once the airbox can flow more, then the velocity stacks become the limiting factor
Post 245 by TLS_Russ,
#245James have you heard anything regarding Mialia tea house being closed today, very strange?
Post 246 by MrZ32,
#246no mate.. why is that... was open saturday. I know not many people have been going there since the new owners... crap coffee and the price jumped up hugely
Post 247 by MrZ32,
#247Post missing
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Post 248 by Willh,
#248Post missing
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Post 249 by kevxtx,
#249getting everything ready for the big dyno day, have even had some spacers made up to fit the motobox to raise the roof of the motobox by as much as 15.5mm (water cut nitrile cork)... this will be to allow for the extra height required for the DVS' to work efficiently.
i for one am getting very excited to try my three different intakes on two different air boxes
i for one am getting very excited to try my three different intakes on two different air boxes
Post 250 by KTM666,
#250Post missing
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Post 251 by MrZ32,
#251Post missing
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Post 252 by TLS_Russ,
#252Post missing
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Post 253 by nampus,
#253well i thanks to the dimensions from Silverbear (and a lot more help than what most would realise),
i sketched up some drawings and had some gasket made up to modify the motobox.
well i dropped by indy's place today on the way home from worked, tried the first spacer... heaps of room.
lets try the thicker spacer... still works... turns out we just got a significant increase from roof of the airbox and the top of the stacks, giving that extra clearance required.
i will test the same thing on my 08 tanked model before i get ahead of myself.
but here is a pic of what i had water cut. If enough people with motobox's are interested, they would not cost that much to make either.
James
i sketched up some drawings and had some gasket made up to modify the motobox.
well i dropped by indy's place today on the way home from worked, tried the first spacer... heaps of room.
lets try the thicker spacer... still works... turns out we just got a significant increase from roof of the airbox and the top of the stacks, giving that extra clearance required.
i will test the same thing on my 08 tanked model before i get ahead of myself.
but here is a pic of what i had water cut. If enough people with motobox's are interested, they would not cost that much to make either.
James
Post 254 by MrZ32,
#254Post missing
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Post 255 by nampus,
#255Nice work! But isn't it possible to fit a tapper filter in the motobox? For figuring out how tall the filter can be, the gaskets would be ideal, but as soon as you know the amount of clearance, a taller filter Should be possible. Or am i missing something.
Edit: judging from the pics, the spacers aren't that thick. In that case, Forget what i just sake.
Edit: judging from the pics, the spacers aren't that thick. In that case, Forget what i just sake.
Post 256 by MrZ32,
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Post 257 by turnip,
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Post 258 by kevxtx,
#258Wow, bolt on 4hp without tuning... Im sold.
Im not quite following the part about the MH Box?
Does it work with it or not? It seems to read like it will with the spacer.
But does the tank fit on properly with the spacer in?
Thanks.
Im not quite following the part about the MH Box?
Does it work with it or not? It seems to read like it will with the spacer.
But does the tank fit on properly with the spacer in?
Thanks.
Post 259 by Linga,
#259Thanks for the run files James received them 10pm last night, I will have a look at them to analyze what is happening with the different stacks & raised lid heights, James I sent an Email last night with a few questions on calcification on the run files numbers.
So what do we know now, these stacks do work, they have been tested on 3 different bikes, with 3 different air boxes on 2 different dynos, all three bikes show similar gains, we now know the stacks need a high air box lid to perform well, the Motor air box needs spacing with the stacks the DNA MK3 does not.
The Future, James is working with the Moto air box & the stacks, I am working with the DNA air box's & stacks, to try & get more out of these stacks & different air boxes.
As mentioned before James has done well with his stack mod & now it has been a proven mod that works with the 3 X 990's been dyno tested.
So what do we know now, these stacks do work, they have been tested on 3 different bikes, with 3 different air boxes on 2 different dynos, all three bikes show similar gains, we now know the stacks need a high air box lid to perform well, the Motor air box needs spacing with the stacks the DNA MK3 does not.
The Future, James is working with the Moto air box & the stacks, I am working with the DNA air box's & stacks, to try & get more out of these stacks & different air boxes.
As mentioned before James has done well with his stack mod & now it has been a proven mod that works with the 3 X 990's been dyno tested.
Post 260 by Linga,
#260I received the aluminium CNC'd Velocity stacks today and ran them on a Dyno.
It was very hot but still got 121.9hp with normal and 124.9hp with them in.
Interesting as the previous Dynojet Dyno had 131hp, apparently this one is able to give a constant load and measures everything a little lower.(and truer)
Thought it would be nice to hear from someone on the otherside of Oz, these are the prototype ones of MrZ32's design.
I'm running:
Motobox no shafts
full Akra EVO
PCIII no O2
Was hoping for more but bikes being bikes, it is never predictable from bike to bike with any mod, mine may just well be a little restricted further down.
Have yet to put the spacer on the Motobox to see the difference but 3hp is promising for just a plain stack, can't wait to see the results of the rest!
It was very hot but still got 121.9hp with normal and 124.9hp with them in.
Interesting as the previous Dynojet Dyno had 131hp, apparently this one is able to give a constant load and measures everything a little lower.(and truer)
Thought it would be nice to hear from someone on the otherside of Oz, these are the prototype ones of MrZ32's design.
I'm running:
Motobox no shafts
full Akra EVO
PCIII no O2
Was hoping for more but bikes being bikes, it is never predictable from bike to bike with any mod, mine may just well be a little restricted further down.
Have yet to put the spacer on the Motobox to see the difference but 3hp is promising for just a plain stack, can't wait to see the results of the rest!
Post 261 by kevxtx,
#261I'm off to the track tomorrow to see if I notice any difference.
I'll be running the first two sessions without and the next with them in, it will be 37C so that'll probably be the best of the reliable morning runs.
I'm timing all with a GPS timer.
I'll be running the first two sessions without and the next with them in, it will be 37C so that'll probably be the best of the reliable morning runs.
I'm timing all with a GPS timer.
Post 262 by Colonel_Klinck,
#262Nice results, James filled me in this evening on your runs, don't worry about the peak HP we are interested in the before & after gains.
Post 263 by loony888,
#263santa is powering up his sleigh and it would be nice if there were a present in it for me with some stacks.... any estimated price?
Really good work!!!
Really good work!!!
Post 264 by Linga,
#264Looking good dude. I can see a few orders coming your way very soon
Post 265 by loony888,
#265Post missing
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Post 266 by MrZ32,
#266Sorry mate, I just read what I wrote and was not clear about what happened, I got 3hp after full remapping.
Post 267 by loony888,
#267ahh righto,
still impressive, shows how little thought was put into the injection of these by keihin/ktm i guess
they look nice too!
still impressive, shows how little thought was put into the injection of these by keihin/ktm i guess
they look nice too!
Post 268 by MrZ32,
#268Post missing
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Post 269 by MrZ32,
#269yeah i figured that looking at the curve, nice consistent improvement through the range, with the new velocity stacks. has anything further happened with the DVS?
PAUL.
PAUL.
Post 270 by TLS_Russ,
#270ok... after lots of mucking around here are my runs... back to back testing (no fuelling changes until tuned on the CNC'd items)
Once again a huge thanks to Andrew at Procycle Dyno 07 3808 4003
http://www.procycledyno.com.au/
he really looked after Indy and I, and really was impressive to watch on the dyno
i will have to post some photos on monday of the dyno day and the mighty SD's
standard Vs carbon stacks (DVS)
standard Vs metal stacks (DVS)
Standard Vs CNC'd stacks
Standard Vs CNC'd stack & carbon DVS
Standard Vs Loaded final run
i will scan in my final power run later coming in at 128hp
Once again a huge thanks to Andrew at Procycle Dyno 07 3808 4003
http://www.procycledyno.com.au/
he really looked after Indy and I, and really was impressive to watch on the dyno
i will have to post some photos on monday of the dyno day and the mighty SD's
standard Vs carbon stacks (DVS)
standard Vs metal stacks (DVS)
Standard Vs CNC'd stacks
Standard Vs CNC'd stack & carbon DVS
Standard Vs Loaded final run
i will scan in my final power run later coming in at 128hp
Post 271 by Colonel_Klinck,
#271for Indy's runs (all done with the motobox and the spacer in)
all standard runs
standard Vs carbon stacks (DVS)
Standard Vs Metal stacks (DVS)
standard Vs CNC'd stacks
standard Vs tuned Metal stacks (DVS) - loaded
his final power run will be posted up shortly by Indy at 134hp i think it was
all standard runs
standard Vs carbon stacks (DVS)
Standard Vs Metal stacks (DVS)
standard Vs CNC'd stacks
standard Vs tuned Metal stacks (DVS) - loaded
his final power run will be posted up shortly by Indy at 134hp i think it was
Post 272 by nampus,
#272Congratulations, good job Only one thing to say looking at those charts...... When can I get some
Post 273 by indy84,
#273Post missing
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Post 274 by MrZ32,
#274Post missing
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Post 275 by Linga,
#275Hey MrZ post my final Hp chart??? please.... Get ready fellow dukers
Post 276 by kevxtx,
#276I will have to pick up your final chart off of you as I do not have a copy of that run... Nor do I have an electronic copy of my 128hp run... Will have to post those on Monday... Are we riding tomorrow?
Post 277 by MrZ32,
#277Post missing
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Post 278 by kevxtx,
#278Finally you make mention of the awesome torque improvements. 5-6 lb feet is terrific. Well done indeed.
Post 279 by Jermo,
#279Awesome results on several bikes!
Post 280 by indy84,
#280Post missing
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Post 281 by MrZ32,
#281now fellas please not, the carbon stacks make the same HP as the metal ones but use less fuel, these would have been on Indy's bike had it not been for my concerns with longevity... they will be ready once for sale however (talking with my carbon fibre mate to increase strength just to be on the safe side (i have however run them for close to 1000km without any issues what so ever).
I am also looking into combining the new VS with the carbon DVS and will be looking into having them made as one piece.
but I will see about the availability of the two separately too (Kev, i will be talking with you shortly)
I am also looking into combining the new VS with the carbon DVS and will be looking into having them made as one piece.
but I will see about the availability of the two separately too (Kev, i will be talking with you shortly)
Post 282 by TLS_Russ,
#282Not thought of having these injection moulded in one piece, you would then have no worries bonding the DVS to the OEM KTM stacks, just a simple one piece replacement for the original KTM parts
Not so nice to look at as carbon or spun aluminium I know, and yes the tooling cost is an upfront investment, but the unit cost would be low,
After all you cant see them when the tank is down A one pice part would be 100% reliable and would look more professional to,
Just a thought
Not so nice to look at as carbon or spun aluminium I know, and yes the tooling cost is an upfront investment, but the unit cost would be low,
After all you cant see them when the tank is down A one pice part would be 100% reliable and would look more professional to,
Just a thought
Post 283 by KTM666,
#283Fantastic results.....
Nice simple way of getting more head room on Motohooligan as well, top hp was with DNA mk3 ?
I agree with russ...all in one would be the way to go...... .could be funded by taking deposit from intrested parties ...I think you will have a lot of intrest
Again well done
Nice simple way of getting more head room on Motohooligan as well, top hp was with DNA mk3 ?
I agree with russ...all in one would be the way to go...... .could be funded by taking deposit from intrested parties ...I think you will have a lot of intrest
Again well done
Post 284 by Jermo,
#284Post missing
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Post 285 by TLS_Russ,
#285Not so very expensive where I work
Post 286 by Jermo,
#286Post missing
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Post 287 by TLS_Russ,
#287Yeah and over here as long as you pay the tooling cost they dont really care if you order 1,000 pieces or 100,000
Also the unit here cost would only be the weight of the material used and a small labour cost for the machine minder, trimmer
Also the unit here cost would only be the weight of the material used and a small labour cost for the machine minder, trimmer
Post 288 by Jermo,
#288Post missing
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Post 289 by MrZ32,
#289show me were to sign only downside is my bike is booked in for a custom map tomorrow
Post 290 by kevxtx,
#290Cheesie... This is the only mod the I know of that will produce more hp and torque while requiring less fuel. If you bike is tuned to a perfect13:1 it will drop to around 12.1:1 so you do not need to worry about running lean. The plus side is that if you do tune it for them you will get better fuel economy as well as more power/torque
Post 291 by MrZ32,
#291From my runs I found below 6500rpm the A/F ratio was rich & after 6500rpm it was OK & agree with James when you lean out the A/F ratio to 13:1 below 6500 rpm you should see a gain in fuel economy, just remember these runs were produced at 100% throttle.
RED run custom made map, BLUE run 2nd stack fitted no map change. Both runs are on the same bike on the same dyno 10min apart.
RED run custom made map, BLUE run 2nd stack fitted no map change. Both runs are on the same bike on the same dyno 10min apart.
Post 292 by MrZ32,
#292at the moment I am looking into pricing of a combined version of the cnc'd stacks and the carbon stacks printed as a one piece plastic item. Otherwise for those who cannot wait I will be able to get some of the carbon stacks knocked up in the mean time but again waiting on prices to get back to me.
I am also looking into further modifications on the motobox for the best conditions for the intakes... read better than all and maybe for a decent price.
more of the fun day last thursday
all these were run on two different bikes
Indy's
and mine
and after the big day... decided to try a different look (although have put the lower fender back on)
I am also looking into further modifications on the motobox for the best conditions for the intakes... read better than all and maybe for a decent price.
more of the fun day last thursday
all these were run on two different bikes
Indy's
and mine
and after the big day... decided to try a different look (although have put the lower fender back on)
Post 293 by MrZ32,
#293slowly getting closer to to a one piece unit
metal stack knock up with a bit of fine tuning
carbon stack know up with tuning
now back to the dyno in a month or two
however for those interested in the CNC'd stacks... i can find out what the cost would be (if you cannot wait.. they are what i am running currently)
metal stack knock up with a bit of fine tuning
carbon stack know up with tuning
now back to the dyno in a month or two
however for those interested in the CNC'd stacks... i can find out what the cost would be (if you cannot wait.. they are what i am running currently)
Post 294 by Colonel_Klinck,
#294interested, send you a PM already !
Post 295 by MrZ32,
#295Thanks Mate,
replied, with an estimate cost however i would recommend waiting on a little bit more testing from my end first. There are 3 guys in brisbane and 1 in perth who are currently testing these items in extreme heat for performance and durability. At this point in time it would be hard to get anything done before early next year.. which will allow for further development until then.
Thankyou for your interest.
James
replied, with an estimate cost however i would recommend waiting on a little bit more testing from my end first. There are 3 guys in brisbane and 1 in perth who are currently testing these items in extreme heat for performance and durability. At this point in time it would be hard to get anything done before early next year.. which will allow for further development until then.
Thankyou for your interest.
James
Post 296 by Colonel_Klinck,
#296Are you saying the carbon stacks are going to be a fair bit cheaper than the CNC'd James?
Post 297 by kevxtx,
#297Post missing
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Post 298 by Colonel_Klinck,
#298Post missing
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Post 299 by kevxtx,
#299Post missing
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Post 300 by kevxtx,
#300Post missing
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Post 301 by indy84,
#301Post missing
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Post 302 by KTM666,
#302Post missing
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Post 303 by MrZ32,
#303thanks for that Kev, nice find. It is a little bit different in application, however it is closer to reality than what you may think as air comes in from the sides (due to where the filter is (except for the standard airbox)). So yes, its a very similar principle... but my intakes are further improved again and have been designed to remove those 'dead' spots in the air flow that are shown (as we have limited room in the airbox, large 'dead' zones are not acceptable in the design criteria).
Post 304 by ktmguy,
#304Nice results James! If you need more testing I might have free or cheap access to the local dyno for a bit.
Maybe I can even do my own thing as I have done the owner a few favours repairing electrical issues on bikes.
Might have to hold off for a bit till it cools down as too hot and humid to do good dyno runs.
I'm currently looking at making an air filter which should work very well with the stacks. I'll keep you posted.
Maybe I can even do my own thing as I have done the owner a few favours repairing electrical issues on bikes.
Might have to hold off for a bit till it cools down as too hot and humid to do good dyno runs.
I'm currently looking at making an air filter which should work very well with the stacks. I'll keep you posted.
Post 305 by Linga,
#305has anyone tested these on an sdr yet, is there a difference in diameter in the v stacks on the sdr than an sd, will you be able to supply the spacer to raise the airbox
Post 306 by MrZ32,
#306They will be tested on an SDR in the next couple of weeks.
Mid January at the latest
Mid January at the latest
Post 307 by stalker,
#307Good morning!
@ MrZ32 wrote a PM to yours on Dec, 15th, but no answer yet.
Did you get it?
Thank you
Roland
@ MrZ32 wrote a PM to yours on Dec, 15th, but no answer yet.
Did you get it?
Thank you
Roland
Post 308 by Jermo,
#308I will have to check tonight... My inbox has been filling up rather quickly lately. I do apologize.
to keep everyone in the loop, the plan is to have 5 bikes from 06 sd's to sdr's and sm's locally for durability testing. If all is looking good expect full scale production by start of Feb.
to keep everyone in the loop, the plan is to have 5 bikes from 06 sd's to sdr's and sm's locally for durability testing. If all is looking good expect full scale production by start of Feb.
Post 309 by MrZ32,
#309argh man . feb now seems miles away .
Post 310 by nampus,
#310Post missing
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Post 311 by Jermo,
#311i keep my fingers crossed that those which are interested can use it before the season starts here in Europe
I need more torque
I need more torque
Post 312 by kevxtx,
#312Post missing
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Post 313 by Linga,
#313Post missing
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Post 314 by MrZ32,
#314Nampus, just use a costum TuneECU map from somebody with the same mods till you have the stacks and then do the dyno time.
Post 315 by ktmjunkie,
#315Once the final stacks have been decided on I will do a custom single cylinder tuned PCV map via Tune link which I will share, as these DVS make the bike run to rich below 5500rpm with the Akra map on my SMR, James SD showed the exact same richness results with his custom map & the DVS installed.
Post 316 by MrZ32,
#316Mine ran rich also across the whole range with the CNC stacks...
Am testing the carbons soon, keen to fell the part throttle response
Am testing the carbons soon, keen to fell the part throttle response
Post 317 by Linga,
#317Post missing
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Post 318 by MrZ32,
#318Post missing
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Post 319 by Colonel_Klinck,
#319ok gents,
you have seen what the intakes can do... i need to get an idea of how many people are seriously interested in buying a pair of these... there is a small amount of testing that i would like to do (small improved modifications as well as better option than a spacer), however it is getting to a point where I am negotiating a price with the carbon fiber guys and another company which will remain un named until after further dyno testing.
so please give me an idea ... add a list to together of who would like a pair (more people, the cheaper it can be... it also means that they can be of a slightly more complex but better design with the possibility of both a DVS and VS replacement). This is not asking for a deposit... just people who are pretty certain that they would want a pair
you have seen what the intakes can do... i need to get an idea of how many people are seriously interested in buying a pair of these... there is a small amount of testing that i would like to do (small improved modifications as well as better option than a spacer), however it is getting to a point where I am negotiating a price with the carbon fiber guys and another company which will remain un named until after further dyno testing.
so please give me an idea ... add a list to together of who would like a pair (more people, the cheaper it can be... it also means that they can be of a slightly more complex but better design with the possibility of both a DVS and VS replacement). This is not asking for a deposit... just people who are pretty certain that they would want a pair
Post 320 by MrZ32,
#320I'll be in mate after a litle more testing
Maybe you should start a new dedicated thread for potential buyers?
Maybe you should start a new dedicated thread for potential buyers?
Post 321 by TLS_Russ,
#321what do you mean you will be in... i think you are the only other person running the carbon intakes other than me
so there are currently 4 pairs being used... two which are combined (CNC VS (to be replaced by carbon ones which are cheaper to make) and the carbon DVS)
so there are currently 4 pairs being used... two which are combined (CNC VS (to be replaced by carbon ones which are cheaper to make) and the carbon DVS)
Post 322 by 990 WFO,
#322So long as it works with a Motobox and the price is fair I'm in.
James have you updated the custom map you sent me with the large amount of ignition advance. Runs lean down low and the cold weather is only aggravating it.
James have you updated the custom map you sent me with the large amount of ignition advance. Runs lean down low and the cold weather is only aggravating it.
Post 323 by MrZ32,
#323i have one that is suited to my bike... however it is leaner than most of the maps out there... but gives a fairly constant 12.9:1
Post 324 by Anata,
#324Count me in. (MH box)
Post 325 by KTM666,
#325count me in for a set of stacks, i assume for a DNA Box no spacer is needed ..
Post 326 by fuel,
#326Count me in (DNA so no spacer needed)
Post 327 by MrZ32,
#327Me too. (moto hooligan box)
Post 328 by 990 WFO,
#3288 pairs so far
Post 329 by SDtaxi,
#329Since your stacks are supposed to increase power across the curve I'm a bit hesitant to add the stacks on the current map I'm running. Its nothing bad, just some hesitation off the line under a lot of throttle and above 3K RPM its fine. Your thoughts? Switch maps? Adjust map? It'll be fine?
Post 330 by stalker,
#330Im in "Motobox"
Anychance of a map for my setup ? PLEASE
Anychance of a map for my setup ? PLEASE
Post 331 by Reb,
#331Count me in (MH box) it comes with a custom map right?
Post 332 by indy84,
#332one set please(depending on price)
Post 333 by Willh,
#333Me too. (MH box). A quick show of hands please . Is everybody running these, or intends to run them, removed their sec. flies and shaft?
Post 334 by Fendt,
#334Im in for sure. I have the MH box. Thanks
Post 335 by nampus,
#335Well..... i already have my set...but... if i didn't i would get a set...
In terms of bolt on horse power its one of the "best bang for bucks" you can get
In terms of bolt on horse power its one of the "best bang for bucks" you can get
Post 336 by Crotchrockety,
#336How much and when? I'm most likely good for a set, but not right now, in the spring after tyres but before dynoing my 2-1 pipe.
Post 337 by 2bigalow,
#337I'll take a set as well for a MH box.
Post 338 by tripoddave,
#338Hi,
I am in as well, not depending if it will be the CNC or split version of the DVS, personally I do not see any reason against the split version.
Take care
Roland
I am in as well, not depending if it will be the CNC or split version of the DVS, personally I do not see any reason against the split version.
Take care
Roland
Post 339 by 327hj,
#339count me in also [mh box]
Post 340 by JohnJJr,
#340I'm in for a set too. (motohooligan box, no flies, no shafts)
Post 341 by MrZ32,
#341Post missing
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Post 342 by MrZ32,
#342oh and up to 24... we might be able to do some pretty cool stuff after all... a carbon VS/DVS is now on the cards.
and for your information, it is not the cheap crappy wet lay up gear that we seem to spend a fortune on... it is the top end autoclaved pre preg gear used in F1 and the like
and for your information, it is not the cheap crappy wet lay up gear that we seem to spend a fortune on... it is the top end autoclaved pre preg gear used in F1 and the like
Post 343 by Bert,
#343don't forget me (motobox)
Post 344 by Colonel_Klinck,
#344James have you posted this on the KTM forum? I'm sure some SD'ers and SM/R owners would def be interested.
Post 345 by MrZ32,
#345And adventurer riders.. Any 990/950 motor really
But no I haven't posted elsewhere... If others wanted to link this onto those sites... That would be appreciated.. That being said I have already just about reached the amount that I can afford on the first batch/run on these things
But no I haven't posted elsewhere... If others wanted to link this onto those sites... That would be appreciated.. That being said I have already just about reached the amount that I can afford on the first batch/run on these things
Post 346 by Colonel_Klinck,
#346Ah in that case not much point atm. Im sure word will spread fast if everyone is happy with what it does to our bikes.
Post 347 by cbecker33,
#347In (grimbox).
-Chris
-Chris
Post 348 by AlpineDuke,
#348I'm interested! Any idea about the price?
Post 349 by Mr_Trecolareco,
#349Post missing
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Post 350 by RRR,
#350OK - I guess I'd like to get in on the first run too
Motobox, please - I like the idea of using less fuel .
Motobox, please - I like the idea of using less fuel .
Post 351 by Colonel_Klinck,
#351Add one --motobox please. And any Motobox spacer additions.
Post 352 by RRR,
#352If you are going to be shipping to the states, then I am another Motobox owner to count in on this shenanigans.
Post 353 by JohnJJr,
#353hey all
just a quick thought , the very first motoboxes were physically wider than the later/current motobox . the box was initially designed around an 05/06 SD which had the smaller capacity tank and a little bit more space underneath it . when the 07 onwards with the larger tank was released the original motobox was a pretty neat fit .
to the best of my knowledge there were very few early boxes out there before Aaron modified his design to fit all models of SD . dunno how much difference this will make to whatever James has come up with to raise the top and give clearance for the dual velocity stacks . just thought it was worth a mention .
that said i am interested in a set from the first batch if poss please . i have a motobox so would need whatever spacer/adapter is reqd . i will also be taking out the secondary flies .
i would like a ballpark idea of cost if poss shipped to the UK .
take it easy
Rich
just a quick thought , the very first motoboxes were physically wider than the later/current motobox . the box was initially designed around an 05/06 SD which had the smaller capacity tank and a little bit more space underneath it . when the 07 onwards with the larger tank was released the original motobox was a pretty neat fit .
to the best of my knowledge there were very few early boxes out there before Aaron modified his design to fit all models of SD . dunno how much difference this will make to whatever James has come up with to raise the top and give clearance for the dual velocity stacks . just thought it was worth a mention .
that said i am interested in a set from the first batch if poss please . i have a motobox so would need whatever spacer/adapter is reqd . i will also be taking out the secondary flies .
i would like a ballpark idea of cost if poss shipped to the UK .
take it easy
Rich
Post 354 by Anata,
#354I bought my Motobox in 2009 I think. I'll PM Aaron to to if its going to be an issue with my 06 bike. Hopefully not.
Post 355 by RRR,
#355i got my first motobox in november 08 and had the modified one by the end of november 08 . my original motobox went to Millar .
if memory serves Aaron made three motoboxes as a trial run to see what interest there was . Joe got one as did someone else in the states , i forget who . i got the other one . a credit to Aaron for sorting stuff as quick as he did . if you did get your motobox in late 09 you should be safe size wise . i suspect there is a pretty low number of original motoboxes out there .
take it easy
rich
if memory serves Aaron made three motoboxes as a trial run to see what interest there was . Joe got one as did someone else in the states , i forget who . i got the other one . a credit to Aaron for sorting stuff as quick as he did . if you did get your motobox in late 09 you should be safe size wise . i suspect there is a pretty low number of original motoboxes out there .
take it easy
rich
Post 356 by TLS_Russ,
#356Post missing
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Post 357 by TLS_Russ,
#357Post missing
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Post 358 by kevxtx,
#358What a thread--Whew!
1.) Is there a timeline/price associated with these stacks?
2). Should I hold off on selling Motobox/buying DNA 3 (for the 1.5 HP's--I know--I AM that kind of guy) as it SOUNDS like a new box is under developement......
Thanks.
1.) Is there a timeline/price associated with these stacks?
2). Should I hold off on selling Motobox/buying DNA 3 (for the 1.5 HP's--I know--I AM that kind of guy) as it SOUNDS like a new box is under developement......
Thanks.
Post 359 by TLS_Russ,
#359hey JohnJJr
like Hidrio said the stacks will still need the spacer in the motobox to allow for height clearance , it was the width of the very early motoboxes that was a little larger . hope this helps
rich
like Hidrio said the stacks will still need the spacer in the motobox to allow for height clearance , it was the width of the very early motoboxes that was a little larger . hope this helps
rich
Post 360 by Colonel_Klinck,
#360Anyone know for sure or actually fitted either a MH box or DNA and kept the lower part of the Standard SD airbox in place
I have very good reasons for asking and it is related to this thread
I have very good reasons for asking and it is related to this thread
Post 361 by MrZ32,
#361Post missing
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Post 362 by TLS_Russ,
#362Post missing
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Post 363 by MrZ32,
#363Post missing
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Post 364 by TLS_Russ,
#364Post missing
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Post 365 by Colonel_Klinck,
#365The problem is always going to be that a lot of the air reaching the throttles bodies has come through the rad. Unless you come up with a ram scoop like I think GoGo did then you'll never get past this problem. As to noise I love the sound my SD makes. Never once had a copper comment on the noise it makes apart from to say it sounds great One once recommended I put the baffles back in but it was pretty tongue in cheek.
Post 366 by TLS_Russ,
#366Post missing
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Post 367 by JohnJJr,
#367Post missing
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Post 368 by Jermo,
#368Could you sum up the gains on several configurations?
Post 369 by ktmjunkie,
#369Please add one more to the list (DNA mk3 most likely)
Post 370 by Zenbiker,
#370Post missing
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Post 371 by MrZ32,
#371Wow, this is fantastic. Been away for a while dealing with the neck surgery (and possible 2nd one), but I just read through the thread and am definitely interested in getting a set to fit my MotoBox...I need to head to the dyno for some tweaking anyway. Brilliant!
Post 372 by MrZ32,
#372Post missing
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Post 373 by Keo,
#373Is there any idea of prices yet and availability
Post 374 by MrZ32,
#374The carbon fibre workshop opens on Mon 16/1. Negotiations start tomorrow I just wanted to know what numbers I was talking
Post 375 by stalker,
#375I'll purchase a set (motobox)
Post 376 by MrZ32,
#376Post missing
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Post 377 by stalker,
#377So around 35 in this run.. So a likely 40 if the ktm forum get involved
Post 378 by Razy,
#378mr z sir , how do you think the stacks would work pod filters as i am just about to shell some hard earned on a dna.
Post 379 by Bert,
#379A proper airbox will allow the vs/dvs to work properly. The vs in the pipeline will not fit pods.. So a DNA,grimbox or motobox will be required.
Post 380 by Razy,
#380thanks
Post 381 by JohnJJr,
#381Post missing
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Post 382 by Razy,
#382All just a question of price and delivery scales.
Post 383 by stalker,
#383Post missing
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Post 384 by Zenbiker,
#384Add me up for a set as well. Probably DNA3.
thx
thx
Post 385 by kowekiller,
#385Post missing
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Post 386 by MrZ32,
#386Post missing
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Post 387 by MrZ32,
#387In theory you can do the same thing by increasing the stack length. Longer means more low end ,less upper. Shorter means more upper, less lower. This is just reducing the stack diameter which is the same thing as a longer stack. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Check this for tuning
Pretty cool. Make that
Please read this !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Check this for tuning
Pretty cool. Make that
Please read this !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post 388 by tripoddave,
#388The idea of the dvs is that I can then use a shorter stack set up for high rpm but use the the dvs to keep or boost up the bottom end.. Best of both worlds... You will be very happy to see what I have currently in the pipeline
Post 389 by bic_bicknell,
#389Well I just got off the phone with the carbon guys. I will be sending through the drawings with a combined VS/DVS. They are assessing any changes that are required for the extra strength of the fins (as those who know me, i don't like doing anything unless its perfect).
They are also going to put together any recommendations in how to keep the cost down as well as if any extra molds are required... And if so, how many for the size of the run
They are also going to put together any recommendations in how to keep the cost down as well as if any extra molds are required... And if so, how many for the size of the run
Post 390 by fuel,
#390What sort of timescale are you working to?
Will you be taking firm orders before commencing the production run?
I for one don't mind sending you the money up front if that makes life easier.
Will you be taking firm orders before commencing the production run?
I for one don't mind sending you the money up front if that makes life easier.
Post 391 by Millar,
#391I do not mind either to send the money upfront!
Just, paypal would be great, of course the fees by my side, for the overseas bank rates are horrible hereover.
Thank you
Roland
Just, paypal would be great, of course the fees by my side, for the overseas bank rates are horrible hereover.
Thank you
Roland
Post 392 by MrZ32,
#392Followed your thread closely since the beginning.
Great work.
Count me in when you are taking orders, Motobox version for me please.
Great work.
Count me in when you are taking orders, Motobox version for me please.
Post 393 by AGRO!,
#393what they said ^
Post 394 by AGRO!,
#394As above too.
Post 395 by nampus,
#395+1
Post 396 by Bert,
#396Mee tooooo pleeeeze
Post 397 by stalker,
#397ok
just a teaser to what i am currently running as i have changed over to a motobox from my grimbox and can now flow the air required for this setup
bear in mind... you wont get cnc stacks (only two people in the world have both... lol)... the whole thing will be carbon
and now for the stuff that will matter for you.... tooling up for the batch run.
these are the jigs that will allow 20 pairs to be part built at a time
just a teaser to what i am currently running as i have changed over to a motobox from my grimbox and can now flow the air required for this setup
bear in mind... you wont get cnc stacks (only two people in the world have both... lol)... the whole thing will be carbon
and now for the stuff that will matter for you.... tooling up for the batch run.
these are the jigs that will allow 20 pairs to be part built at a time
Post 398 by MrZ32,
#398Gee Mr Z,
You certainly know how to tease.
Have you any idea on price and availablity yet
You certainly know how to tease.
Have you any idea on price and availablity yet
Post 399 by tripoddave,
#399Judging by the pic's looks like his wallet is getting fatter!!
Post 400 by kevxtx,
#400I was out today with my DVS in the mountains behind Brisbane & the bike is unreal in the mid range 6000 to 8500 RPM theres so much more torque in that range, I now tend to shift sooner then without them, they make a big difference.
Torque Dyno run displayed
Blue dyno run tuned with single cylinder tunning no DVS fitted. Verse Green run DVS fitted, no mapping change no custom mapping with the DVS. The only thing changed between these two runs is the Dual Velocity Stacks.
Torque Dyno run displayed
Blue dyno run tuned with single cylinder tunning no DVS fitted. Verse Green run DVS fitted, no mapping change no custom mapping with the DVS. The only thing changed between these two runs is the Dual Velocity Stacks.
Post 401 by MrZ32,
#401Glad you really like them mate... It changes the way you ride... The bike then pulls strongly from 3k.
I know silverbear has been enjoying his too.
As for price... I have an idea in mind.. It is just trying to work out a way to get it to that price but I don't want to disclose it as I may not be able to reach my target
I know silverbear has been enjoying his too.
As for price... I have an idea in mind.. It is just trying to work out a way to get it to that price but I don't want to disclose it as I may not be able to reach my target
Post 402 by Colonel_Klinck,
#402Any rough idea of a shipping date James?
Post 403 by TLS_Russ,
#403Post missing
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Post 404 by MrZ32,
#404All good things to those who wait
I`m liking that torque curve, looking very much like my TLs, nice steep jump from just over 5k perfect for firing out of corners
I`m liking that torque curve, looking very much like my TLs, nice steep jump from just over 5k perfect for firing out of corners
Post 405 by Bert,
#405Well I just changed over to a modified motobox... Holy crap!!! Engine spins up so much faster, revs harder, louder intake noise... Wow just wow... Maybe I will break 130hp after all
After looking at the two back to back I understand why the grimbox can't cut it... The domed head allows a much better flow in the air... Looking forward to re testing with the Motobox and the even newer vs/dvs combo (different to what you have seen int the previous pics but better)
After looking at the two back to back I understand why the grimbox can't cut it... The domed head allows a much better flow in the air... Looking forward to re testing with the Motobox and the even newer vs/dvs combo (different to what you have seen int the previous pics but better)
Post 406 by stalker,
#406MrZ32, stop teasing us
Post 407 by JohnJJr,
#407+1 . getting unbearable
Post 408 by Colonel_Klinck,
#408Yeah - Fooking Come on Mang !!!!
This can only be a big marketing scheme to get top dollar - OK everyone Stop showing interest ....
This can only be a big marketing scheme to get top dollar - OK everyone Stop showing interest ....
Post 409 by One67,
#409Wish i could say to Hell with it and i dont want any LOL :
Post 410 by kevxtx,
#410Best marketing scheme ever! Half the forum can't get their wallets out fast enough for something we've yet to see, me included
Post 411 by MrZ32,
#411I'm pissing all over the floor like an over excited puppy
Post 412 by cdlabate,
#412Post missing
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Post 413 by MrZ32,
#413Post missing
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Post 414 by JohnJJr,
#414Solid gold pussy dude!
Post 415 by indy84,
#415Post missing
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Post 416 by MrZ32,
#416Post missing
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Post 417 by nampus,
#417Post missing
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Post 418 by MrZ32,
#418Post missing
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Post 419 by nampus,
#419This is driving me nuts.
i get up in the morning rush home from work and log on just to see if theres any uread posts on this thread.
Im even having one last check before i go to bed even though ive just checked a couple of mins earlier.
Please hurry up and give us an idea of availability and costings
i get up in the morning rush home from work and log on just to see if theres any uread posts on this thread.
Im even having one last check before i go to bed even though ive just checked a couple of mins earlier.
Please hurry up and give us an idea of availability and costings
Post 420 by omky756,
#420Hi, good morning!
Btw., did anybody do any testing with foam filters like these from Pipercross of the automotive section?
To my opinion there should be nearly no restriction to the airflow and even with the dirt should be no matter as they are used in much dirtier conditions.
Any reasons against?
Roland
Btw., did anybody do any testing with foam filters like these from Pipercross of the automotive section?
To my opinion there should be nearly no restriction to the airflow and even with the dirt should be no matter as they are used in much dirtier conditions.
Any reasons against?
Roland
Post 421 by kevxtx,
#421Post missing
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Post 422 by MrZ32,
#422Post missing
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Post 423 by AndersH,
#423Post missing
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Post 424 by larryf8,
#424Someone keep me updated on this, when something is for sale? I haven't read the thread, as I I don't understand half of the tecnique. I just want the bike to run better
So these twenty pages has all been about some new velocity stacks, which is like a funnel for air, that sits inside the airbox? hmm
So these twenty pages has all been about some new velocity stacks, which is like a funnel for air, that sits inside the airbox? hmm
Post 425 by kevxtx,
#425Post missing
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Post 426 by Anata,
#426Post missing
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Post 427 by MrZ32,
#427The ones being printed would be expensive, however I do ha a dulled down version that is easily made... And should keep the cost reasonable... And the airflow will almost be the same[/quote]
Almost be the same? How much better are the 3D printed ones and would they be available if someone was willing to pay the extra cost?[/quote]
A 3D printed complete DVS set would take around 3 hours to make & would cost around Australian $400 per set at my cost my price for one offs, the 3D stacks will be made 100% to the designed spec. To get 2 sets printed & to Dyno test them on two different bikes would cost over $1000 for the 2 sets & Dyno time & that is just to see if they will work.
I don't think you guys realise how much money has been poured in behind the scenes by James & others to make the many proto types + Dyno test them, & the work is still going on to find more HP & Torque. Not only has James been woorking on the DVS but there is a nice surprise for the MH owners to come.
Almost be the same? How much better are the 3D printed ones and would they be available if someone was willing to pay the extra cost?[/quote]
A 3D printed complete DVS set would take around 3 hours to make & would cost around Australian $400 per set at my cost my price for one offs, the 3D stacks will be made 100% to the designed spec. To get 2 sets printed & to Dyno test them on two different bikes would cost over $1000 for the 2 sets & Dyno time & that is just to see if they will work.
I don't think you guys realise how much money has been poured in behind the scenes by James & others to make the many proto types + Dyno test them, & the work is still going on to find more HP & Torque. Not only has James been woorking on the DVS but there is a nice surprise for the MH owners to come.
Post 428 by kevxtx,
#428Post missing
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Post 429 by kevxtx,
#429Post missing
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Post 430 by MrZ32,
#430The dna box will still will be the best by a measurable margin... It just means that the motobox will work with the dvs. I will do a back to back test with the DNA mk3 and the motobox... You guys will just have to work out what you want when you see the results
Post 431 by kevxtx,
#431I am sure the guys will be happy, you have catered for both air boxes.
Post 432 by omky756,
#432Post missing
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Post 433 by MrZ32,
#433Post missing
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Post 434 by nampus,
#434The printed stacks are to prove a point on back to back dyno runs.. The intakes do not need to last very long. My concern with the printed intakes is that they will become brittle and fail over time... And where these things sit, failure is not an option. Carbon fibre has been proven and used in intakes for some time now and will be the way forward.
so no, the printed intakes will not be produced for sale until proven.
in the future it could be possible to retrofit a part to make it the same as the printed pair, however that is a fair way off
so no, the printed intakes will not be produced for sale until proven.
in the future it could be possible to retrofit a part to make it the same as the printed pair, however that is a fair way off
Post 435 by indy84,
#435If the stacks are printed in ABS plastic there will not be any problems in the long term at all. We are just printing & testing at the moment as it is much cheaper for one offs, for a production run of complete DV stacks James will more than likely use carbon if the latest design works, otherwise the stacks some of us are running at the moment in Oz work great.
Post 436 by nampus,
#436Post missing
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Post 437 by Jermo,
#437ABS printed = more expensive than carbon... considerably.
injected = less than carbon but only on big batch runs
injected = less than carbon but only on big batch runs
Post 438 by Colonel_Klinck,
#438Really pissing me off checking this forum and finding no unread posts on this thread.
Bet a few of you looked at this though
Bet a few of you looked at this though
Post 439 by Stratkat,
#439all this time and money with a 1300cc SD right around the corner? save your money men!
Post 440 by indy84,
#440Post missing
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Post 441 by MrZ32,
#441Post missing
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Post 442 by MrZ32,
#442Post missing
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Post 443 by One67,
#443There is a high possibility that this is the case... But at the moment I am dealing with what is currently available
Post 444 by TLS_Russ,
#444Post missing
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Post 445 by Colonel_Klinck,
#445Post missing
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Post 446 by tripoddave,
#446From the interest shown on here I don't think many are thinking about the 2013 SDR. There is a whole 12 months of biking between now and then and personally even if it is a kick ass SDR I would be buying new anyway. Bring on the DVS James, can't wait to install a set in my beloved SD.
Post 447 by MrZ32,
#447Post missing
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Post 448 by loony888,
#448Am i asking for too much here or could this be possible.
When the carbon velocity stacks become available would it also be possible to get the uprated higher lid or spacer for my "bought last year " motobox and the best breather mod kit all in one hit.
PLEASE
When the carbon velocity stacks become available would it also be possible to get the uprated higher lid or spacer for my "bought last year " motobox and the best breather mod kit all in one hit.
PLEASE
Post 449 by MrZ32,
#449That's the plan mate... It is just about getting all the behind the scenes stuff done. But yes they will be sold together after showing you the proof that it works
Post 450 by Colonel_Klinck,
#450Post missing
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Post 451 by KTM666,
#451Post missing
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Post 452 by kevxtx,
#452fellas.. i am gutted, and am very sorry,
pricing has come through and carbon fiber is no longer an option. I am back to the drawing board... do not fret though. I have some ideas that may come to fruition shortly. I am also talking with Kevtxx about other avenues but all is not lost, and you guys are most certainly not forgotten.
I am very sorry for getting your hopes up and having to put it on hold for a short while (dont think for a second that i am giving up though).
Regards
James
PS: how do you feel about abs plastics?
pricing has come through and carbon fiber is no longer an option. I am back to the drawing board... do not fret though. I have some ideas that may come to fruition shortly. I am also talking with Kevtxx about other avenues but all is not lost, and you guys are most certainly not forgotten.
I am very sorry for getting your hopes up and having to put it on hold for a short while (dont think for a second that i am giving up though).
Regards
James
PS: how do you feel about abs plastics?
Post 453 by tripoddave,
#453Thats a bummer for you dude. What was the price just out of curiosity?
I don't personally care what they are made of as long as they are safe and of course affordable.
I don't personally care what they are made of as long as they are safe and of course affordable.
Post 454 by emuexport,
#454Post missing
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Post 455 by Viking,
#455if you have a 3d cad model, what about using a 3d printing service ? I'm just testing this one here http://www.shapeways.com
For all which want a quick, easy and cheap solution, use the shorter RC8 stacks, they work pretty well without the secondary throttle plate
and offer about 3-4 HP starting at around 6000 RPM including torgue gains . No gains under 6000 like with the DVS but they do cost
only 2.5 Euros each and thats what i would call best bang for the buck. With secondary plates you will loose power, so only do this mod
if you have removed them .
For all which want a quick, easy and cheap solution, use the shorter RC8 stacks, they work pretty well without the secondary throttle plate
and offer about 3-4 HP starting at around 6000 RPM including torgue gains . No gains under 6000 like with the DVS but they do cost
only 2.5 Euros each and thats what i would call best bang for the buck. With secondary plates you will loose power, so only do this mod
if you have removed them .
Post 456 by Colonel_Klinck,
#456James still has some other options to get the cost down, so watch this space. He does have some local names for 3d printing, they are not cheap to 3D print.
Post 457 by tripoddave,
#457Post missing
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Post 458 by MrZ32,
#458Where can you buy rc8 intakes for £5 a pair? They cost us almost 40 aus dollars. But I will investigate to combine both as the rc8 intakes were similar to the VS items that I was looking at doing (but would expect an extra 3hp over the rc8 VS)... Cost may be dooable
Post 459 by Viking,
#459I expect this can be done easily at home.
Just need to find a smaller diameter longer stack and bond it in place with the 3 fin idea.
Bingo. DVS.
I know that oversimplified but guys have been putting dual stacks on bikes for decades so should be do'able.
Just need to find a smaller diameter longer stack and bond it in place with the 3 fin idea.
Bingo. DVS.
I know that oversimplified but guys have been putting dual stacks on bikes for decades so should be do'able.
Post 460 by No. 47,
#46061241040000 INTAKE TRUMPET
Price: £1.80 (Inc VAT at 20%) each.............here in the UK.
Price: £1.80 (Inc VAT at 20%) each.............here in the UK.
Post 461 by Colonel_Klinck,
#461No probs MR Z,
thanks for trying and for keeping on trying.
Ive no probs what there made out of but abs would be fine.
Regarding the Shorter RC8 stacks,its been said that you gain power above 6000rpm but do yoy lose anything below ?
thanks for trying and for keeping on trying.
Ive no probs what there made out of but abs would be fine.
Regarding the Shorter RC8 stacks,its been said that you gain power above 6000rpm but do yoy lose anything below ?
Post 462 by Anata,
#462I would imagine the part that actually connects to the throttle bodies is the most expensive bit to produce isn't it James? Does the RC8 one look anything like what you were designing?
Edit: I actually just read your post above
Edit: I actually just read your post above
Post 463 by Colonel_Klinck,
#463Post missing
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Post 464 by Viking,
#464is there any loss of low rpm power? as fitting longer or shorter stacks normally just moves the torque curve up or down, ie you gain higher up but loose down low
Post 465 by kevxtx,
#465Post missing
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Post 466 by Colonel_Klinck,
#466All good apart from i cant get any coz i decided to be super cool and different and fitted pods so new stacks will need new pods and the chances are they'll do bugger all with out an airbox.
I'll stick to being cool with my shitty BHP figure then.
I'll stick to being cool with my shitty BHP figure then.
Post 467 by Colonel_Klinck,
#467Post missing
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Post 468 by kevxtx,
#468it is not the combination of Highscores package which makes the RC8 stacks work, i understand he wants to sell stuff
and we had already endless discussions in the German forum about his conclusions.
If you remove the secondary throttle butterfly you will gain no matter if you use a Remus, Arka header or standard, if
add the RC8 stacks you will gain more. It is as simple as that.
Of course combining a proper airbox with a different exhaust header, butterflies removed, RC8 stacks and a proper
custom mapping will be the best solution. Thats what Highscores dynocharts show, because he wants to sell the
complete package, but that is nothing new ...
New is only that the RC8 stacks can work and we can only thank the guys who spend endless hours on the dyno to actually
proove the modifcations. Thanks to the internet this can be shared and hopefully not everybody wants to max
out his bank account. Highscores airbox is basically based on a desing posted in this forum as well as the DNA Airbox.
So when you go for dyno time take the stacks with you, test them out and if you are not happy you lost 5 Euros.
and we had already endless discussions in the German forum about his conclusions.
If you remove the secondary throttle butterfly you will gain no matter if you use a Remus, Arka header or standard, if
add the RC8 stacks you will gain more. It is as simple as that.
Of course combining a proper airbox with a different exhaust header, butterflies removed, RC8 stacks and a proper
custom mapping will be the best solution. Thats what Highscores dynocharts show, because he wants to sell the
complete package, but that is nothing new ...
New is only that the RC8 stacks can work and we can only thank the guys who spend endless hours on the dyno to actually
proove the modifcations. Thanks to the internet this can be shared and hopefully not everybody wants to max
out his bank account. Highscores airbox is basically based on a desing posted in this forum as well as the DNA Airbox.
So when you go for dyno time take the stacks with you, test them out and if you are not happy you lost 5 Euros.
Post 469 by bic_bicknell,
#469Great info, I have organised a set of RC8 stacks today.
I will do back to back dyno runs to see the gains & losses between a standard SD & RC8 stack. I will also T up with James to get his inner stack fitted to measure the gains from a Dual stack using the RC8 stacks.
I will do back to back dyno runs to see the gains & losses between a standard SD & RC8 stack. I will also T up with James to get his inner stack fitted to measure the gains from a Dual stack using the RC8 stacks.
Post 470 by MrZ32,
#470Does anyone know the dimensions (hight and width) of the SD trumpets? Can't be arsed to take bike apart to measure the figures.
Cheers
Cheers
Post 471 by Colonel_Klinck,
#471A picture says more than thousand words:
The blue base run is from a SD with open air box, race can, Remus-header and dialed in fuel injection with 2nd plates installed. The green graph shows the benefit by removing solely the plates at this bike. The red graph shows the improvement by installing RC8-stacks onto the the throttle body.
This mod shortens the intake tract by 20mm. So not only peak torque shifts from 6700 to 7200, but the whole pattern of torque is shifted to the right, to higher rpm. This is not unexpected, when shortening the intake. But what seems curious, is that huge gain, the short RC8-stacks produce, at the very bottom of the engine range around 3000 rpm.
The explanation: Obviously with the short stacks the engine harmonics changed to a higher order, probably from the third to the fourth.This wave has not the energy of a 3rd-order-harmonic, but the advantage to arive more often within the engine range and works now even around 3000-3500.
In the range between 3500 and peak torque at 7200 with short stacks advantages and disadvantages of high-order- and low-order-harmonic are balanced pretty nicely, so there are no substantial gains and losses, just a clear visible different graph pattern.
This dyno runs have been made on the same day, same bike, same dyno and operator. So removing that 2nd plates and installing RC8-stacks should by good to release +6HP. That mod works independently, which exhaust system is installed. I have checked another SD with stock headers, the effect was pretty the same
But it is also evident, that this mod shows its best performance in the higher rpm range. Therefore its is also no surprise, that an exhaust header, tuned especially for this range, shows an even better gain, when combined with hat new harmonics by the RC8-stacks.
The Remus-header is an example for such a lay out. So it is no wonder but a matter of physics, that this header performs so nicely with that new intake trumpet ( And it has nothing to do with the fact, that I have designed this Remus-pipe, indeed it is a great luck that things match so nicely).
Highscore
The blue base run is from a SD with open air box, race can, Remus-header and dialed in fuel injection with 2nd plates installed. The green graph shows the benefit by removing solely the plates at this bike. The red graph shows the improvement by installing RC8-stacks onto the the throttle body.
This mod shortens the intake tract by 20mm. So not only peak torque shifts from 6700 to 7200, but the whole pattern of torque is shifted to the right, to higher rpm. This is not unexpected, when shortening the intake. But what seems curious, is that huge gain, the short RC8-stacks produce, at the very bottom of the engine range around 3000 rpm.
The explanation: Obviously with the short stacks the engine harmonics changed to a higher order, probably from the third to the fourth.This wave has not the energy of a 3rd-order-harmonic, but the advantage to arive more often within the engine range and works now even around 3000-3500.
In the range between 3500 and peak torque at 7200 with short stacks advantages and disadvantages of high-order- and low-order-harmonic are balanced pretty nicely, so there are no substantial gains and losses, just a clear visible different graph pattern.
This dyno runs have been made on the same day, same bike, same dyno and operator. So removing that 2nd plates and installing RC8-stacks should by good to release +6HP. That mod works independently, which exhaust system is installed. I have checked another SD with stock headers, the effect was pretty the same
But it is also evident, that this mod shows its best performance in the higher rpm range. Therefore its is also no surprise, that an exhaust header, tuned especially for this range, shows an even better gain, when combined with hat new harmonics by the RC8-stacks.
The Remus-header is an example for such a lay out. So it is no wonder but a matter of physics, that this header performs so nicely with that new intake trumpet ( And it has nothing to do with the fact, that I have designed this Remus-pipe, indeed it is a great luck that things match so nicely).
Highscore
Post 472 by No. 47,
#472@kevxtx and @highscore
Thank you both for sharing usefull information and bringing the Superduke community to new horizons !
Thank you both for sharing usefull information and bringing the Superduke community to new horizons !
Post 473 by Colonel_Klinck,
#473How do the Akra titanium full system headers compare to the Remus?
Interesting info and thanks for sharing dude.
Interesting info and thanks for sharing dude.
Post 474 by JohnJJr,
#474Post missing
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Post 475 by No. 47,
#475On the subject of low run injection moulding tools.
I know several companies in the UK that specialise in rapid prototype tooling which I've done business with over the years. Mostly it's to product low runs of sample packaging, caps bottles, dispense mechanisms etc. The reason they are cost effective is that they often have limited cooling capacity, are designed for hand operation rather than high speed automation and will wear out quickly. They are really slow and inefficient to mould huge volumes of samples but are ideal for making hundreds, (rather than thousands or millions).
If anyone our there has a CAD model of one of these velocity stacks that require moulding I would be happy to get a few quotes for a low run, single cavity tool. Most of these companies will take a look at the component design and suggest a few ways to design the tool. Different ways will have different cost implications and advantages. Where they choose to inject the material will have an effect on component strength.
The guys I have worked with are very good. Omega does BMW prototype moulding for their engine components, last time I was up there they had a new water pump they were building for them. They can inject with any number of polymers and materials, super high heat resistant stuff, nylon, ABS, all sorts.
And check out this little video of a hand assembled tool from Omega:-
http://www.omega-plastics.co.uk/rapid-prototype-tooling
And this is another company I've worked with.
http://www.geminiprototyping.co.uk/default.html
I know several companies in the UK that specialise in rapid prototype tooling which I've done business with over the years. Mostly it's to product low runs of sample packaging, caps bottles, dispense mechanisms etc. The reason they are cost effective is that they often have limited cooling capacity, are designed for hand operation rather than high speed automation and will wear out quickly. They are really slow and inefficient to mould huge volumes of samples but are ideal for making hundreds, (rather than thousands or millions).
If anyone our there has a CAD model of one of these velocity stacks that require moulding I would be happy to get a few quotes for a low run, single cavity tool. Most of these companies will take a look at the component design and suggest a few ways to design the tool. Different ways will have different cost implications and advantages. Where they choose to inject the material will have an effect on component strength.
The guys I have worked with are very good. Omega does BMW prototype moulding for their engine components, last time I was up there they had a new water pump they were building for them. They can inject with any number of polymers and materials, super high heat resistant stuff, nylon, ABS, all sorts.
And check out this little video of a hand assembled tool from Omega:-
http://www.omega-plastics.co.uk/rapid-prototype-tooling
And this is another company I've worked with.
http://www.geminiprototyping.co.uk/default.html
Post 476 by Anata,
#476Well i have been brainstorming and may have come up with a viable solution... I will let you know as soon as it starts to come together.
along the lines of a modified rc8 intake (pet hate of the standard intakes which is what led me to the dvs in the first place... poor design and can be improved significantly) with a DVS... more pricing is being looked into now
along the lines of a modified rc8 intake (pet hate of the standard intakes which is what led me to the dvs in the first place... poor design and can be improved significantly) with a DVS... more pricing is being looked into now
Post 477 by tripoddave,
#477Big thanks to Highscore!
Post 478 by No. 47,
#478Post missing
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Post 479 by bic_bicknell,
#479I just bought a pair from here.
They are usually very good service.
http://shop.jimaimracing.co.uk/acatalog ... 09-12.html
They are usually very good service.
http://shop.jimaimracing.co.uk/acatalog ... 09-12.html
Post 480 by skip,
#480Just ordered mine from Jimaim
Post 481 by Colonel_Klinck,
#481I bet all these dealers are wondering wtf is going on
Post 482 by jambox,
#482Post missing
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Post 483 by jambox,
#483Post missing
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Post 484 by skip,
#484Just had a call from Jim aim motorcycles saying that they would have to order the stacks in but the price was wrong, apparently they should be about a £10 , anyway they are going to honour the online price.
Post 485 by bic_bicknell,
#485Ha ha,
I just had a missed call from them while I was out at lunch.
I just had a missed call from them while I was out at lunch.
Post 486 by fuel,
#486Just had a call from Jim Aim regarding my order, they were very curoius as to why so many were being ordered 10 sets so far this morning!
Post 487 by tripoddave,
#487Duke and Highscore sure do have a lot to answer for!
Post 488 by Linga,
#488$7 here in OZ I'm surprised!
Post 489 by tripoddave,
#489Post missing
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Post 490 by KTM666,
#490This just shows what a great site this is .......got mine ordered this morning.....
Post 491 by Colonel_Klinck,
#491Post missing
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Post 492 by MrZ32,
#49240 For the pair of SD trumpets... 20 In Brisbane for the rc8 pair.
Team homo are rip offs withe the worst service imaginable.
So I refuse to use them... Even if it costs me more to import them
Team homo are rip offs withe the worst service imaginable.
So I refuse to use them... Even if it costs me more to import them
Post 493 by Anata,
#493Post missing
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Post 494 by Colonel_Klinck,
#494Post missing
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Post 495 by kevxtx,
#495Post missing
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Post 496 by MrZ32,
#496me either after I had to replace my waterpump seal at my own cost while under warranty... Otherwise it would have taken over six months to fix (I knew what was wrong but they reckoned it was the radiator cap, then the pipes, etc...)... Then charged me a fortune for the parts.
Post 497 by indy84,
#497Post missing
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Post 498 by Doon,
#498Post missing
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Post 499 by JohnJJr,
#499i think i may have missed a beat here . can someone help out a brotha ..
Are these stacks everyone's talking about now just twist on a standard SD ? In other words we're putting SDR stacks on the Standard SD ?
Even though the SDR has bigger throttle bodies the SDR stacks will fit right on Standard ?
thnx
Are these stacks everyone's talking about now just twist on a standard SD ? In other words we're putting SDR stacks on the Standard SD ?
Even though the SDR has bigger throttle bodies the SDR stacks will fit right on Standard ?
thnx
Post 500 by kevxtx,
#500Post missing
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Post 501 by KTM666,
#501Post missing
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Post 502 by MrZ32,
#502Indy and I pick up a mill/lathe tomorrow... All hope is not lost gets. Some fab work and testing to come. Klink... Email me some payment details and I will take you up on the rc8 stacks for modification and testing .
Post 503 by Lowrance,
#503Headed to the stealer tomorrow!
Does anyone know whether they pulled just the secondary plates or the shafts as well? I still have not pulled my shafts out.
Thanks.
Does anyone know whether they pulled just the secondary plates or the shafts as well? I still have not pulled my shafts out.
Thanks.
Post 504 by MrZ32,
#504Post missing
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Post 505 by Lowrance,
#505The RC8R intake trumpets are available here in the US for $5 ea from Munn Racing outta Texas. I just ordered 4 for a buddy and myself. Told him to be expecting a few calls.
http://www.munnracing.com/
P/N - 61241040000
Can see how this will help as it will increase the distance from the mouth of the trumpet to the top of the airbox reducing airflow restriction.
John
http://www.munnracing.com/
P/N - 61241040000
Can see how this will help as it will increase the distance from the mouth of the trumpet to the top of the airbox reducing airflow restriction.
John
Post 506 by nampus,
#506Post missing
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Post 507 by Lowrance,
#507this has nothing to do with the distance to the airbox the effect is the same even without the airbox, it is all about resonance in the intake you can actually calculate the optimal stack /trumpet length for a given RPM range, but theory and reality is often different. Lot of people believed you need longer trumpets to get Superduke running well, myself included. So actually it is a surprise that the shorter ones work so well without the secondary butterfly.
Post 508 by emuexport,
#508Post missing
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Post 509 by Lowrance,
#509Post missing
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Post 510 by Colonel_Klinck,
#510Sorry, can't answere that one as the only year the SDR was imported into the US was in 08.
Checked both 2010 and 2012 RC8R fiche and both are the same part number: 61241040000
You can check the fiche yourself: http://www.munnracing.com
Another resource: http://www.ktm-parts.com/pdf/KTM2012/20 ... C8_R_w.pdf
08 Superduke R: http://www.ktm-parts.com/pdf/KTM2008/2008_990SDR.pdf
Checked both 2010 and 2012 RC8R fiche and both are the same part number: 61241040000
You can check the fiche yourself: http://www.munnracing.com
Another resource: http://www.ktm-parts.com/pdf/KTM2012/20 ... C8_R_w.pdf
08 Superduke R: http://www.ktm-parts.com/pdf/KTM2008/2008_990SDR.pdf
Post 511 by Viking,
#511Correct !
Part no. 61241040000 is the one to order/buy!
At my dealers system they show just as the RC8 ones.
Changing and testing must wait due to temp (-12 to -14 Celsius in the morning!) and too much snow at the moment !
Part no. 61241040000 is the one to order/buy!
At my dealers system they show just as the RC8 ones.
Changing and testing must wait due to temp (-12 to -14 Celsius in the morning!) and too much snow at the moment !
Post 512 by ktmjunkie,
#512Gear4 just called and it seems Austria KTM have run out of RC8 stacks Not sure when they will be back in stock but I'm thinking its going to be a couple of weeks at least.
Post 513 by JohnJJr,
#513Jim Aim emailed this morning and said they expect delivery Monday/Tuesday. No mention of a price hike either.......which they can't really do after advertising and selling at the onsite price.
Ktm must be wondering wtf is going on.
Highscore will be laughing his ass off if this is a wind up and 50 sheep have rushed out and raped the RC8 stack stock.
Ktm must be wondering wtf is going on.
Highscore will be laughing his ass off if this is a wind up and 50 sheep have rushed out and raped the RC8 stack stock.
Post 514 by Lowrance,
#514Post missing
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Post 515 by ktmjunkie,
#515It is not hard to bring the KTM-factory out of stock with this RC8-stack. When the RC8 came out in 2008 I had a chance to took a view onto its stacks. At this time I had before tuned some 2008-SD-R-bikes using the same 52-mm-TB.
The SD-R uses the same velocity stack as the "common" SDs displacing the the 48mm TB, because the larger type is just a "big bore" version of the same TB mold.
I checked the price for the RC8-trumpet, it was - like in our days - close to nothing, so I decided to order 10 pcs for further testing with the SD. I received 9 units - and this was the whole stock of the KTM-factory during this early period of RC8-production.
Looks like now as a bad guy has bought all the factory stock too.
Of course I have tested that short RC8-stack at several Sds and SD-Rs. In each case that 20mm shorter stacks dis not work: peak power at the top remained unchanged, but there was a lack in torque over the lower part of the range: no advantage using this stacks. So this stacks rested since 2008 in an edge of my workshop - until this January.
During this early testings the 2nd. butterfly kept in place, just the stacks have been changed. But this year I made the testings without the butterfly and suddenly - wow. The effect was really unexpected for me. And this was not a single-shot-wonder, I have installed until now that RC8 stacks to 3 SD-bikes and in each case this mod - 2nd flies out & RC8-stacks on - was good for a power increase of 6-7 HP. So I am telling here no fake stories, it really looks like as this mod could be a worthwhile one.
Well, it is not my intention to hijack this thread with my own stories, so I prefer to start a new one. Just two things:
(1) That three promising testings all have been performed with a "common" SD with 48mm-TB. The question is, what will happen at a 2008-SD-R with larger valves, larger intake duct, lager 52mm-TB and different cam timing? This question needs further investigation.
(2) Retarding air box design: The rule of thumb is that the distance of an intake trumpet to a wall upside should be at least trumpet diameter. But this rule is only valid for the "common" situation, where the bell diameter is the same as the diameter of the intake tract. In the case of the SD-engine things are different. Here the bore-diameter of the intake duct is 48mm up to primary throttle, controlled by the throttle grip. From that diameter upward the bore of the intake tract enlarges continuously up to some + 60mm at the end of the trumpet bell mouth.
Well I am the creator of this:
My cheap and simple air box lacks that rule of thumb by far.. So it was essential for me before starting production of this box to check its performance. What could be a better reference for such a test as testing the box against intake trumpets within the pure air, real "atmosphere" with nothing over them (fuel tank lifted)? The cover of this air box has just a (good) finger distance to the trumpets. But nevertheless it did not suffer and made the same performance as "nothing on" at the bells:
By at 2012-02-11
This is the last test regarding this problem I have performed this January. I hope you agree with me that the difference is neglectable since the price for filtered air is unavoidably around 15mm water and 15mbar restriction cause therefore something like a loss a loss of 1-1,5% in performance compared to real free breathing intakes.
Hey, It is not intention to hijack this thread. More information will come at a new place. But give me some time.
Highscore
The SD-R uses the same velocity stack as the "common" SDs displacing the the 48mm TB, because the larger type is just a "big bore" version of the same TB mold.
I checked the price for the RC8-trumpet, it was - like in our days - close to nothing, so I decided to order 10 pcs for further testing with the SD. I received 9 units - and this was the whole stock of the KTM-factory during this early period of RC8-production.
Looks like now as a bad guy has bought all the factory stock too.
Of course I have tested that short RC8-stack at several Sds and SD-Rs. In each case that 20mm shorter stacks dis not work: peak power at the top remained unchanged, but there was a lack in torque over the lower part of the range: no advantage using this stacks. So this stacks rested since 2008 in an edge of my workshop - until this January.
During this early testings the 2nd. butterfly kept in place, just the stacks have been changed. But this year I made the testings without the butterfly and suddenly - wow. The effect was really unexpected for me. And this was not a single-shot-wonder, I have installed until now that RC8 stacks to 3 SD-bikes and in each case this mod - 2nd flies out & RC8-stacks on - was good for a power increase of 6-7 HP. So I am telling here no fake stories, it really looks like as this mod could be a worthwhile one.
Well, it is not my intention to hijack this thread with my own stories, so I prefer to start a new one. Just two things:
(1) That three promising testings all have been performed with a "common" SD with 48mm-TB. The question is, what will happen at a 2008-SD-R with larger valves, larger intake duct, lager 52mm-TB and different cam timing? This question needs further investigation.
(2) Retarding air box design: The rule of thumb is that the distance of an intake trumpet to a wall upside should be at least trumpet diameter. But this rule is only valid for the "common" situation, where the bell diameter is the same as the diameter of the intake tract. In the case of the SD-engine things are different. Here the bore-diameter of the intake duct is 48mm up to primary throttle, controlled by the throttle grip. From that diameter upward the bore of the intake tract enlarges continuously up to some + 60mm at the end of the trumpet bell mouth.
Well I am the creator of this:
My cheap and simple air box lacks that rule of thumb by far.. So it was essential for me before starting production of this box to check its performance. What could be a better reference for such a test as testing the box against intake trumpets within the pure air, real "atmosphere" with nothing over them (fuel tank lifted)? The cover of this air box has just a (good) finger distance to the trumpets. But nevertheless it did not suffer and made the same performance as "nothing on" at the bells:
By at 2012-02-11
This is the last test regarding this problem I have performed this January. I hope you agree with me that the difference is neglectable since the price for filtered air is unavoidably around 15mm water and 15mbar restriction cause therefore something like a loss a loss of 1-1,5% in performance compared to real free breathing intakes.
Hey, It is not intention to hijack this thread. More information will come at a new place. But give me some time.
Highscore
Post 516 by Anata,
#516Post missing
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Post 517 by AGRO!,
#517Post missing
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Post 518 by KTM666,
#518Post missing
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Post 519 by Lowrance,
#519Good info guys. This thread just keeps getting better!
Post 520 by indy84,
#520My thought on this subject is if you want more power just get a 1000cc sports bike problem solved
Post 521 by ktmguy,
#521Post missing
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Post 522 by Anata,
#522Post missing
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Post 523 by Colonel_Klinck,
#523Post missing
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Post 524 by Colonel_Klinck,
#524Post missing
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Post 525 by bic_bicknell,
#525The TuneECU thread on here is very useful. As is the pdf from their site. It's not difficult to get your head around. Not sure if anyone has done an ignition advance map with TuneECU for the SMR A few more ponies might appear there.
Post 526 by No. 47,
#526My understanding here is that the SDR stacks are an ALTERNATIVE solution to getting better resonance.
I'd rather have Mr.Z32's dual velocity stacks when they are ready to manufacture, (because the effort that has gone into them and because they appeal to me more and I think they will show a better power gain), but in the short term the SDR stacks sound like something to play with. At such a small price they must be worth a try. For me though the big issue is that I would want to remove the secondaries and shafts at the same time, (currently running the MH modified flies), and then I feel that I would want to get another custom map done. Still running the PC3 so this means a £150 dyno run). But I will do it this spring I think.
Unless the dual stacks are imminent.
I'd rather have Mr.Z32's dual velocity stacks when they are ready to manufacture, (because the effort that has gone into them and because they appeal to me more and I think they will show a better power gain), but in the short term the SDR stacks sound like something to play with. At such a small price they must be worth a try. For me though the big issue is that I would want to remove the secondaries and shafts at the same time, (currently running the MH modified flies), and then I feel that I would want to get another custom map done. Still running the PC3 so this means a £150 dyno run). But I will do it this spring I think.
Unless the dual stacks are imminent.
Post 527 by MrZ32,
#527RC8/R not SDR stacks, surely...........
Post 528 by indy84,
#528Post missing
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Post 529 by kevxtx,
#529Post missing
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Post 530 by Linga,
#530James was alread onto the lower stack mod, I had the Solid works design a month ago.
In theroy the RC8 stacks looks like it needs a better lip to draw the air over the stack, James has already worked a plan for this so watch this space.
In theroy the RC8 stacks looks like it needs a better lip to draw the air over the stack, James has already worked a plan for this so watch this space.
Post 531 by JohnJJr,
#531I'm also running a CNC version of the stacks and am very happy.
I also have the carbon DVS to insert.
The only reason we don't have Dyno charts is because my bike didn't rock up. Sorry MrZ
I also have the carbon DVS to insert.
The only reason we don't have Dyno charts is because my bike didn't rock up. Sorry MrZ
Post 532 by harvester,
#532Post missing
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Post 533 by ktmjunkie,
#533Post missing
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Post 534 by kevxtx,
#534[quote="MrZ32"
Unless the dual stacks are imminent.[/quote]
Before the rc8 stack thing was realised I already had a model of a different intake of similar height (and was being priced up) but of far superior design to work with the dvs.. Alas it was all to expensive. I now have a lathe and mille and will do them up myself.[/quote]
Dont meen to come acrooss pushy but av you any idea when you will have these stacks ready to ship
One Eager Beaver
Unless the dual stacks are imminent.[/quote]
Before the rc8 stack thing was realised I already had a model of a different intake of similar height (and was being priced up) but of far superior design to work with the dvs.. Alas it was all to expensive. I now have a lathe and mille and will do them up myself.[/quote]
Dont meen to come acrooss pushy but av you any idea when you will have these stacks ready to ship
One Eager Beaver
Post 535 by Lowrance,
#535Interesting stack from eBay:
http://www.ebay.at/itm/Powerblade-Trich ... 4162a5e7bf
They wrote it is from KTM Sommer..
Found a German forum too about it:
http://www.ktmforum.eu/forum3/wbb/990-s ... owerblade/
http://www.ebay.at/itm/Powerblade-Trich ... 4162a5e7bf
They wrote it is from KTM Sommer..
Found a German forum too about it:
http://www.ktmforum.eu/forum3/wbb/990-s ... owerblade/
Post 536 by AGRO!,
#536Post missing
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Post 537 by KTM666,
#537Post missing
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Post 538 by bic_bicknell,
#538Don't know how they coould be effective with a butterfly set up. They are very popular with the flat slide Kehin carb crowd as they butt right up against the slide. This reduces/eliminates turbulance at partial throttle openings by preventing incomming flow from hitting the slide, being deflected downward and creating rotors in the rest of the incomming air.
Post 539 by Lowrance,
#539As ktmjunkie wrote, they take out the jerkiness of the LC8 engine, the effect is given but not so impressive and only with a complete standard setup of the airbox. Highscore had some runs in comparision with his airbox, butterflies still in, and there was no effect or better, it was a kind of contraproductive with the open flow airbox.
If someone wants to give it a try, I have a set lying arround.
Next will be the removal of the flies and shafts (allready done but not tested) and hopefully the DVS of MrZ and may be going to give the Rottweiler airbox a chance .
If someone wants to give it a try, I have a set lying arround.
Next will be the removal of the flies and shafts (allready done but not tested) and hopefully the DVS of MrZ and may be going to give the Rottweiler airbox a chance .
Post 540 by ktmjunkie,
#540Post missing
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Post 541 by Anata,
#541Post missing
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Post 542 by KTM666,
#542I just fitted the RC8 stacks. Just in case anyone else comes up against the same issues as I - the fit is not quite the same as the old stacks. There are two clips at the base which slide under a flange on the throttle bodies when you turn the stacks on. The RC8 clips are a bit higher so they don't allow the stacks to turn far enough for them to spring up on the other side. This is a big problem as they need to lock on to prevent them coming off when the engines running. I had to trim them down by about half a mm and put a bit of a radius on the edges to act as a lead in and out - otherwise they get stuck on and it's hard to get them off again. Hard to describe in words but you'll understand if you are fitting them.
It might be to do with the Motobox being a bit thicker than the standard airbox base but the old stacks fitted fine.
Not been out for a run yet - just started raining. HM Racing said that they wouldn't effect my fueling map so I'm just going to see what the difference feels like to ride with - if I can notice anything different.
It might be to do with the Motobox being a bit thicker than the standard airbox base but the old stacks fitted fine.
Not been out for a run yet - just started raining. HM Racing said that they wouldn't effect my fueling map so I'm just going to see what the difference feels like to ride with - if I can notice anything different.
Post 543 by Anata,
#543Post missing
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Post 544 by Lowrance,
#544Bic, and anyone else that's installed the RC8R trumpets, have you noticed any decrease in low-end or mid-range power?
I've got them sitting here on my bench but don't have time to install them before I take off. Will be putting them in when I return (2nd week of April). Just want to make sure there is no seat-o-the pants loss down in the lower parts of the RPM range.
Thanks, John
I've got them sitting here on my bench but don't have time to install them before I take off. Will be putting them in when I return (2nd week of April). Just want to make sure there is no seat-o-the pants loss down in the lower parts of the RPM range.
Thanks, John
Post 545 by ktmjunkie,
#545Post missing
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Post 546 by Jermo,
#546Looks like stock stacks and 2nd flies removed is the best option out of those runs.
Nice comparison runs for removing 2nd flies
Nice comparison runs for removing 2nd flies
Post 547 by ktmjunkie,
#547Post missing
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Post 548 by kevxtx,
#548I know I noticed a bit of difference when I removed the 2nd flies. It seemed snappier, so to speak.
Post 549 by kevxtx,
#549have you made any headway on the dvs mrz32
Post 550 by Jermo,
#550The RC8 stacks definitely give more HP up top, my bike hits the rev limiter a lot quicker now, I also have my DVS fitted to the RC8 stacks, the bike feels real good all over, the DVS still need some tweaking to fit the RC8 stacks better.
I will get it on the Dyno soon to see the gains.
I will get it on the Dyno soon to see the gains.
Post 551 by kevxtx,
#551cheers for that kev, why has your throttle bodies got the flies back in them? and whats in the three pipes and looks like makeup
Post 552 by MrZ32,
#552They are my spare set of complete SD throttle bodies that I am going to get bored out by +2mm with a +2mm bigger throttle plate for my next mod, the SDR throttle bodies are to big for my standard inlet valve size.
The 3 pipes that look like makeup are cats, 2 of them are my spare 100 flow cats for my modified Leovince pipes, the other bigger one is a spare 100 flow cat. The cats have been designed so I can install & remove them in 10 min when I want to, they are slip in & out cats. I don't like the smelly exhaust smell on my work cloths.
The 3 pipes that look like makeup are cats, 2 of them are my spare 100 flow cats for my modified Leovince pipes, the other bigger one is a spare 100 flow cat. The cats have been designed so I can install & remove them in 10 min when I want to, they are slip in & out cats. I don't like the smelly exhaust smell on my work cloths.
Post 553 by kevxtx,
#553The kat will only work optimal when the SAI is working since the kats need extra oxygen for the chemical reaction.
Post 554 by MrZ32,
#554Post missing
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Post 555 by ktmjunkie,
#555sai on the overrun around 4k rpm... With kevs mapping the sai is not really necessary as it doesn't run stupidly rich like the akra map
Post 556 by ktmjunkie,
#556Hey James did you get my Email I sent you on Tuesday?
Post 557 by kevxtx,
#557Yeah mate... When are you going? Looking forward to seeing the results. I reckon after the modification work (before sticking in the dvs) that another 3hp is available over the standard rc8 stack.
After some very much appreciated help from Klink I will have 5 pairs of rc8 stacks to play with and about 500 bucks worth of machine grade abs rod... Drop by sometime soon. Am starting to make up the tooling for the stacks. Thiss will be enough to make a couple of test stacks;)
Now have the lathe, mill, mechanical bandsaw, the linisher... All ready to roll... Just need a press now.
After some very much appreciated help from Klink I will have 5 pairs of rc8 stacks to play with and about 500 bucks worth of machine grade abs rod... Drop by sometime soon. Am starting to make up the tooling for the stacks. Thiss will be enough to make a couple of test stacks;)
Now have the lathe, mill, mechanical bandsaw, the linisher... All ready to roll... Just need a press now.
Post 558 by ktmjunkie,
#558Post missing
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Post 559 by kevxtx,
#559any updates mrz32, I fitted the rc8 stacks today the bike somehow seems louder more induction noise, or maybe a bit of wax fell out after my shower
Post 560 by ktmjunkie,
#560Post missing
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Post 561 by MrZ32,
#561You can get away with the rc8 stacks once the 2ndry flies are removed because once they are removed you gain an extra 20mm of intake tract, hence why you can use the rc8 intakes which are roughly 20mm shorter than standard. In theory you should lose performance if you were to add rc8 stacks with secondary flies still in... Obviously there is more to it but typing with my left hand is frustrating
Post 562 by JohnJJr,
#562Post missing
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Post 563 by kevxtx,
#563From my Dyno runs I could see by only removing the 2nd fles & shafts the A/F ran richer because of less air speed. Dyno results from the same bike, same Dyno, same RON & fuel manufacture, I have taken the average A/F ratio of all the runs & posted the average results for each run, no map change.
2nd flies removed in RED same fuel map as BLUE run BLUE = Akra map loaded, Akra map was tweaked with Tune ECU using Dynojets Wideband commander 1 before Dyno testing.
By fitting the RC8 stacks only the A/F ratio ran leaner.
RC8 Stack in RED same fuel map as BLUE run Blue run Akra map loaded + custom PCV map, the only thing changed was the standard stacks were removed & RC8 stacks fitted.
2nd flies removed in RED same fuel map as BLUE run BLUE = Akra map loaded, Akra map was tweaked with Tune ECU using Dynojets Wideband commander 1 before Dyno testing.
By fitting the RC8 stacks only the A/F ratio ran leaner.
RC8 Stack in RED same fuel map as BLUE run Blue run Akra map loaded + custom PCV map, the only thing changed was the standard stacks were removed & RC8 stacks fitted.
Post 564 by bic_bicknell,
#564That's a great test to post mate. Well done, I know it's a bit of a hassle to actually fiddle about with hardware when your'e in the dyno shop.
Just a thought though - if you fitted the RC8 stacks AND removed the secondary flies I wonder if the AF mix would be about right, ie cancel each other out? I have/ had a perfect map for the last few years but fitted the RC8 stacks just to see if I could tell a difference, (so I'm probably running a bit lean). I haven't taken out the secondaries because I believed it would really need remapping to be safe. But this makes me wonder if I'd be better off taking them out anyway - even if I don't get round to a remap for a few months.
Just a thought though - if you fitted the RC8 stacks AND removed the secondary flies I wonder if the AF mix would be about right, ie cancel each other out? I have/ had a perfect map for the last few years but fitted the RC8 stacks just to see if I could tell a difference, (so I'm probably running a bit lean). I haven't taken out the secondaries because I believed it would really need remapping to be safe. But this makes me wonder if I'd be better off taking them out anyway - even if I don't get round to a remap for a few months.
Post 565 by Jermo,
#565From what it looks that combination should run a little less lean then the current mapping in lower revs so I guess you'll be fine.
@ Kev,
could you post the power/torque output of those runs as well? I'd like to see what difference it makes dispite the A/F being a little off and how much this A/F being off influence the output in the end.
Is there any idea when the short DVS will be tested?
@ Kev,
could you post the power/torque output of those runs as well? I'd like to see what difference it makes dispite the A/F being a little off and how much this A/F being off influence the output in the end.
Is there any idea when the short DVS will be tested?
Post 566 by ktmjunkie,
#566Post missing
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Post 567 by Jermo,
#567Post missing
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Post 568 by kevxtx,
#568Post missing
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Post 569 by KTM666,
#569Hi Kev
On your last dyno run with RC8 stacks did they change the fueling much?
I have installed my RC8 stacks and it feels like its running weak at lower revs (seat of the pants dyno)
On your last dyno run with RC8 stacks did they change the fueling much?
I have installed my RC8 stacks and it feels like its running weak at lower revs (seat of the pants dyno)
Post 570 by Jermo,
#570His previous post shows the change in A/F after just fitting the RC8 stacks (without changing the map).
Post 571 by Linga,
#571glad you posted up the a/f kev, I had my bike set up during the winter with a custom map but then decided to try the rc8 stacks only to find it running poor I first thought it running rich so took them out it seemed to fix it but it developed a flat spot in the mid range, I tried the rc8 stacks again today and sure enough it runs worse, the only thing I have done to the map was to try and load it onto the computer so unless I have doent somthing to it I cant understand why it is now running so lean, after it was mapped with a pcv it was great, I cant find any leaks in the exhaust and no cracks, its looking like another trip to the dyno
Post 572 by kevxtx,
#572Post missing
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Post 573 by Linga,
#573Post missing
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Post 574 by speedmotorrad,
#574Ok, please tell us lame SD owners if this RC8 mod is on the "good mod" list or not. Should I wait for these dvs stacks to get made? Im so confused. Seriously. I have been reading this thread since it started and Im not really sure what the outcome is so far.
Please help a lame guy understand!
Please help a lame guy understand!
Post 575 by ktmjunkie,
#575RC8 stacks are cheap, smash em on if you want but MrZ has a few more ponies to let out if he can stop breaking bones!!
Post 576 by Bert,
#576Just FYI, RC8 stacks are on international backorder in the US with an expected date of 5/29/12.
Post 577 by ktmjunkie,
#577Post missing
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Post 578 by MrZ32,
#578Post missing
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Post 579 by ktmjunkie,
#579ktmjunkie, take a look at this post: viewtopic.php?p=166000#p166000
Post 580 by ktmjunkie,
#580Post missing
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Post 581 by JohnJJr,
#581Post missing
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Post 582 by Lowrance,
#582I'm another reason for the shortage. I have MH box and secondary flies removed (shafts still in). I installed the RC8 stacks and went straight to the track not having riden the bike for two months due to travel for work so cannot really say what diiference the stacks made. The bike pulled well off the corners so doubt there was any loss of low to mid. I did manage to knock a second or so of my lap times but I'm chocking that up to some suspension modifications I'd made (slightly stiffer springs to increase ground clearance). If the A/F ratio does change it'll be minor so wouldn't sweat it.
I say take your bike for a blast on a known route (25-30 miles or so), go back to your garage and install the RC8 stacks then do the exact same loop and report back your seat O pants impression.
John
I say take your bike for a blast on a known route (25-30 miles or so), go back to your garage and install the RC8 stacks then do the exact same loop and report back your seat O pants impression.
John
Post 583 by kevxtx,
#583Post missing
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Post 584 by ktmjunkie,
#584Post missing
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Post 585 by bic_bicknell,
#585I am going to swap back to my standard SD stacks this weekend until I finally get around to removing my secondary flies and shafts and get a remap done. My custom map for the engine before was already very good with about 126 bHP, great torque and a perfect A/F line. I wanted to see if there was a difference with the RC8 stacks but to be honest I couldn't tell from just road riding and it concerns me that riding with them without a new map might be running lean through some of the rev range - with no real benefit.
Post 586 by dade,
#586It is not my intention to inflate this thread with my own stories so I prefer to satrt a new one
Highscore
Highscore
Post 587 by Lowrance,
#587MrZ I'm between the latest to confirm my interest... I have the potential to ask you from one to ten dvs for a lot of friends of mine with their SDs... both with motobox, DNA bix or OE airbox...
Just waiting when they are available....
Just waiting when they are available....
Post 588 by Lowrance,
#588Just got back from first street ride (did a track day 2 weeks ago) after RC8 trumpet installation and there is definitely a substantial increase in mid to top-end HP/Torque. No loss of low-end as far as my seat O pants can tell. I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't experienced it for myself.
Cannot keep front end down in 2nd gear now. Had to tug on the bars @ 6K to get it to come up in second previously. Now I have to lean forward in a futile effort to try and keep it from comming up in 2nd @ 6K.
Definitely money ($15) well spent!
Cannot keep front end down in 2nd gear now. Had to tug on the bars @ 6K to get it to come up in second previously. Now I have to lean forward in a futile effort to try and keep it from comming up in 2nd @ 6K.
Definitely money ($15) well spent!
Post 589 by dade,
#589@ Lowrance: What else is modified on your SD ?
Post 590 by MrZ32,
#590my sdr needed mapped big time with them fitted it ran realy poor from idle
Post 591 by Jermo,
#591Mine runs great from idle to redline.
08 SD, MH box, secondary flies removed (shafts still in), PCIII USB Custom Dual map, SAS, O2, Leos, Carrozzerias, 520 kit (stock gearing), etc, etc, etc.
08 SD, MH box, secondary flies removed (shafts still in), PCIII USB Custom Dual map, SAS, O2, Leos, Carrozzerias, 520 kit (stock gearing), etc, etc, etc.
Post 592 by DGShannon,
#592Hi all... Any news?
Post 593 by jambox,
#593The cast comes off in two weeks... Everything is ready to go for the the finalised pieces and 10 pairs once final proofing has been completed.
Post 594 by KTM666,
#594good news!
More available in the future?
More available in the future?
Post 595 by JohnJJr,
#595Forgive the noobie question, but what improvement does removing the secondary butterflies accomplish?
I see the MotoHooligan offers a reshaped butterfly, but I have seen no reference to anyone using them
Everyone just seems to take them out, sometimes including the shaft.
Assume more flow, and better mid to top end. What is the cost to low end, or around town performance?
I see the MotoHooligan offers a reshaped butterfly, but I have seen no reference to anyone using them
Everyone just seems to take them out, sometimes including the shaft.
Assume more flow, and better mid to top end. What is the cost to low end, or around town performance?
Post 596 by DGShannon,
#596Post missing
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Post 597 by Willh,
#597Tried both/always ways (MH, removed and secondarys and flys removed).....its not even close MUCH better without just cannot tell some folk
RC8 inlets ...made much bigger difference than I would have thought.......so waiting for Mrz32 with baited breath
RC8 inlets ...made much bigger difference than I would have thought.......so waiting for Mrz32 with baited breath
Post 598 by 990 WFO,
#598Post missing
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Post 599 by JohnJJr,
#599Post missing
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Post 601 by KTM666,
#601Is it mandatory to contact a dealer to purchase the RC8 inlets or is there somewhere online I can get them from (US)?
Post 602 by dade,
#602no more news?
Post 603 by 990 WFO,
#603After a bit of a spill with a dealer in CA, my final RC8 stack is being shipped and should be here soon. My only concern is if my map is up for the task or not. I'm currently running a custom TuneECU map created by MrZ and the bike pulls strong, but its a bit skittish in the lower revs which I'm sure the new stacks will only make worse. Is anyone running a map that is in the TuneECU archives that they know for sure is handling the new stacks well? My mods are in my sig if more info is needed.
Post 604 by MrZ32,
#604fitted the rc stack and a stage three dna airbox and a remap and to tell the truth it felt a bit flat below 7000 rpm with very little gain after and all before what I now think is the pcv packing in, goin to get in touch with dynojet again, last time they were not helpfull at all, anyway I am looking forward to mrz32 dvs going into production, if I dont set fire to the bike first
Post 605 by Colonel_Klinck,
#605hmm... what's this?
they will be going through dyno testing when I have money again.
I will have one spare pair though
they will be going through dyno testing when I have money again.
I will have one spare pair though
Post 606 by KTM666,
#606me me me me me !!!
Post 607 by No. 47,
#607if you find another set.....me me me me me
Post 608 by Colonel_Klinck,
#608glad to see these back on the go mr zee
Post 609 by JohnJJr,
#609No, I'm Spartacus..........
Post 610 by kevxtx,
#610Post missing
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Post 611 by Grendel,
#611LOL
I'm Spartacus
I'm Spartacus
Post 612 by MrZ32,
#612Looking good mate, we will catch up soon.
Post 613 by Colonel_Klinck,
#613I'm Grendel.
Post 614 by CEREC1,
#614Post missing
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Post 615 by NME,
#615Post missing
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Post 616 by Aphex,
#616Is it on TV over Christmas?
Feel the need to watch it now
Feel the need to watch it now
Post 617 by MrZ32,
#617I know I'm new here, but if they add to the overall effect of the whole airbox / torque experience - put me down for a set!
Nice.
Nice.
Post 618 by Keenaz,
#618Put me down for a set also, about to purchase a Rottweiler Intake. Would be nice to have these so I can remove the flies also and get a tune all at once.
Post 619 by MrZ32,
#619who has a rotty airbox in bris to check that they will fit?
Post 620 by Colonel_Klinck,
#620I do mate. You've offered plenty of advice to me over the last couple of months so happy to help out if I can.
Only catch is I leave for Bali on the 14th and wont be back and free again till the 27th.
Only catch is I leave for Bali on the 14th and wont be back and free again till the 27th.
Post 621 by MrZ32,
#621Post missing
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Post 622 by nampus,
#622Have you cracked the Motobox hight issue Aaron?
Post 623 by MrZ32,
#623Post missing
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Post 624 by Mr_Trecolareco,
#624Post missing
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Post 625 by MrZ32,
#625Post missing
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Post 626 by Keenaz,
#626No problemo bud.
Maybe I can catch up with ya via pm or for a cofee next week to discuss before the honeymoon? I dropping the bike at Procycle Dyno when I leave on the 13th so the more info I can give him the better (and less cost to me)
Maybe I can catch up with ya via pm or for a cofee next week to discuss before the honeymoon? I dropping the bike at Procycle Dyno when I leave on the 13th so the more info I can give him the better (and less cost to me)
Post 627 by MrZ32,
#627Post missing
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Post 628 by MrZ32,
#628Hi There !
Any news so far concerning the DVS?
Cheers
Roland
Any news so far concerning the DVS?
Cheers
Roland
Post 629 by Nathan990,
#629I'm saving for the final bit of testing... very hard this time of year
but if I get any money for Christmas. . It will go into these
but if I get any money for Christmas. . It will go into these
Post 630 by dade,
#630Pretty keen on seeing the dvs results. Aron (keenaz) was telling me about these a few weeks ago and I only just noticed this thead now. They look great. I would throw away some peak hp for more low down tourque in a heartbeat with the smoothness of 2ndry removal. If you need another SD to test them on let me know.
Post 631 by MrZ32,
#631Forgive me MrZ It's been a long time and i don't remember if the dvs will fit both SD and SDR 132... with motobox or standard airbox... (ok could read the whole 3d again but i'm LAZY, yes...). I could buy more or less at least 5 couple, so I'm on. If you need money and have paypal it could be a good idea to accept prorders at a price that you think is fair and get the rest of the money just before you send the items to us...
Post 632 by stalker,
#632Blimey.... I have just read all 30 pages of this thread ..... thanks KTM666 (!) and it would appear that I have indeed learnt something...
Yep, sign me up for a pair Mr Z32 when they eventually become available .... excellent dedication ......
Yep, sign me up for a pair Mr Z32 when they eventually become available .... excellent dedication ......
Post 633 by Colonel_Klinck,
#633thanks guys. .. last (hopefully) tweaked intakes will be ready on the 4/2 with final lot of dyno testing booked in on the 8/2. the final trumpets being tested are production ready.
So after the proof for the production model I will start taking orders... thanks for the patience all... I'm pretty excited about it all. hopefully all this time money and effort will be worth it for you guys.
So after the proof for the production model I will start taking orders... thanks for the patience all... I'm pretty excited about it all. hopefully all this time money and effort will be worth it for you guys.
Post 634 by kevxtx,
#634price ?
estimated delivery time to the uk ?
estimated delivery time to the uk ?
Post 635 by MrZ32,
#635Good work dude. Can't wait to get them on the SD
Post 636 by nampus,
#636A little teaser for you guys these might be the very last version before production, James sent me through the Solid Works drawings last week & one of my good friends Kev2 3d printed these stacks for me over night, they took 8 hrs each to make amazing stuff Solid works & 3D printing. I would scare you if I told you how much the retail cost of this set was, we will put it all down to research & development.
I look forward to seeing the Dyno results James, as mentioned I will have this set on my bike tomorrow & will build a custom map for the stacks straight away.
I look forward to seeing the Dyno results James, as mentioned I will have this set on my bike tomorrow & will build a custom map for the stacks straight away.
Post 637 by kevxtx,
#637Post missing
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Post 638 by nampus,
#638They look really nice!
@kevxtx: Are you installing them in your shortened rc8 stacks, stock rc8 stacks or the stock sd stacks?
And for which stacks are these designed? The rc8 ones or the superduke ones?
@kevxtx: Are you installing them in your shortened rc8 stacks, stock rc8 stacks or the stock sd stacks?
And for which stacks are these designed? The rc8 ones or the superduke ones?
Post 639 by kevxtx,
#639Jame's designed these latest one's so they will fit any stack, I will be testing them in a few different combinations of stacks which all have different dimensions to see what suits my riding best. + Jame's latest Lipped main stack which is on my bike now with my DVS stacks fitted, I will swap over the latest design stacks this evening so I have a direct butt comparrison, the real results will come from the final Dyno testing on the 8/2 which James is conducting.
Post 640 by nampus,
#640Nice, I'm looking forward to the results. Any chance of a sneap preview of the solution for the lack of height above the stacks inside the motohooligan airbox? Or is that no longer a problem?
I have to say it again, amazing effort you guys put into this project!
I have to say it again, amazing effort you guys put into this project!
Post 641 by MrZ32,
#641That problem was sorted a while back & has already been produced, so when the DVS hit the streets the option will be there for the guys who want every gain they can get out of the MH box.
Post 642 by No. 47,
#642Very nice!
Post 643 by CEREC1,
#643Post missing
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Post 644 by stalker,
#644Any thoughts as to how these might, or not, work with pod filters?
Post 645 by CEREC1,
#645Post missing
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Post 646 by Jermo,
#646Post missing
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Post 647 by stalker,
#647See if we can find somebody going to Australia who can bring em back in hand luggage, don't want to pay customs duty and VAT unless we have too.
Post 648 by MrZ32,
#648
a progression from the left. .. original to better and better
Post 649 by Colonel_Klinck,
#649Post missing
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Post 650 by stalker,
#650Post missing
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Post 651 by MrZ32,
#651Post missing
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Post 652 by hjp1968,
#652I'm in for a group buy to the uk
Post 653 by kevxtx,
#653Post missing
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Post 654 by kevxtx,
#654Will they work with the Rotwieler type airfilter?
These are not really still air boxes, someone once told me (not sure if it is true) that these filters are like there is nothing there so would this bugger up the DVS? Though the Motobox can't really be described as a still airbox, can it?
These are not really still air boxes, someone once told me (not sure if it is true) that these filters are like there is nothing there so would this bugger up the DVS? Though the Motobox can't really be described as a still airbox, can it?
Post 655 by MrZ32,
#655Hard to say as we have only ever tested them with MH & DNA air box types, I did ask if anyone in Brisbane had a foam type filter for me to Dyno test so I could do back to back testing but no one came forward.
Post 656 by MrZ32,
#656Post missing
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Post 657 by Colonel_Klinck,
#657Post missing
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Post 658 by kevxtx,
#658Post missing
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Post 659 by MrZ32,
#659Outstanding work guys. Truly outstanding.
Post 660 by AGRO!,
#660I would go for a ride today with the printed stacks but with 125 KPH winds & 300mm of rain I am not game. http://images.brisbanetimes.com.au/2009 ... -420x0.jpg
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/southeast ... public_rss
http://www.smh.com.au/environment/weath ... 2deip.html
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/southeast ... public_rss
http://www.smh.com.au/environment/weath ... 2deip.html
Post 661 by ktmguy,
#661it is like a tropical downpour that normally lasts for 20mins max but it hasn't stopped for the last two days... in fact it's getting worse.
Post 662 by AGRO!,
#662From stinking HOT to relentless rain and tomorrow its supposed to be worse I LOVE IT !!
Post 663 by MrZ32,
#663Take care down there guys it's not looking good! Keep safe!
Post 664 by Jermo,
#664Thanks mate. Did you see all the flooding down this way on the news
The wind has been wild also there have been trees laying on the road and all sorts of debris.
The wind has been wild also there have been trees laying on the road and all sorts of debris.
Post 665 by CEREC1,
#665After some preliminary testing (read back to back butt dyno testing and review of auto tune results (thanks for the help kev)) of the printed stacks i have a feeling that this last pair may just make my originally designed items seem lame... and the last pair worked very well.
Post 666 by kevxtx,
#666Post missing
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Post 667 by stalker,
#667Just a thought, are these going to work on,and improve an RC8
Post 668 by ktmguy,
#668As James mentioned I have been testing the latest 3D printed DVS with the new STD lipped stacks for the past few days & have built a single cylinder map & have to say my bike has never gone so well with improvements everywhere especially in the mid range, nice work James.
Post 669 by kevxtx,
#669
Post 670 by Linga,
#670I am currently running a set on my SDR and have also tested the CNC billet ones.
I have the redesigned RC8 stack also, if a spare set become available then I'll test those as well, all back to back.
I'm very unreliable due to work taking me away though.
I have the redesigned RC8 stack also, if a spare set become available then I'll test those as well, all back to back.
I'm very unreliable due to work taking me away though.
Post 671 by kevxtx,
#671Did a road test today after my Dyno tune last week and as expected the grunt from 6 to 8000rpm was amazing.The dyno showed up to a 9hp increase in this area and plateaued out to a final 5hp at 9000hp.Gingers creek was never so easy.Cheers
Post 672 by AGRO!,
#672Nice gains. I think you going to like the latest stack best one I have run, adds even more gains with the lipped stacks.
Post 673 by Spy84,
#673Post missing
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Post 674 by stalker,
#674Hello everyone.I would like to order some stacks are they avalable yet?
Post 675 by Mr_Trecolareco,
#675Post missing
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Post 676 by MrZ32,
#676I believe the list goes around the corner of the block
Get this done and I suggest as a next project for the forum are the cams
Post 677 by kevxtx,
#677Post missing
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Post 678 by MrZ32,
#678Would it be possible to purchase lipped standard stacks ?
Post 679 by kevxtx,
#679You mean like the one I am currently running STD lipped stacks?
Post 680 by MrZ32,
#680Post missing
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Post 681 by bic_bicknell,
#681Yes, the stacks you are running kevxtx, because my bike is completely standard.. Only wanted to know, because i don't want to take serious action with mapping and dyno and so on.
Post 682 by Linga,
#682James is borrowing these STD lipped stacks for the Dyno shoot out on Friday, as James mentioned to carry stock of the lipped STD stacks cost quite a bit more than the RC8 stacks.
Post 683 by MrZ32,
#683Post missing
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Post 684 by bic_bicknell,
#684I am a bit confused as to the status of these Dual-Velocity stacks which I've watched being developed over the last year or so. (Good work guys!! )
So - to cut to the chase.
Is there a final design developed that shows real gains with a modified airbox? (If so is it power or torque or both?)
Are they being made in limited production runs?
Are they available to purchase yet?
How much are they?
Can I have a set? (I want to remove my secondaries before the good weather in Spring and get a final custom map made up and this would be the ideal time to replace the stacks. I currently have the RC8 short stacks fitted)
So - to cut to the chase.
Is there a final design developed that shows real gains with a modified airbox? (If so is it power or torque or both?)
Are they being made in limited production runs?
Are they available to purchase yet?
How much are they?
Can I have a set? (I want to remove my secondaries before the good weather in Spring and get a final custom map made up and this would be the ideal time to replace the stacks. I currently have the RC8 short stacks fitted)
Post 685 by Stratkat,
#685Final testing is on Friday!
Post 686 by bic_bicknell,
#686Post missing
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Post 687 by Stratkat,
#687Great news.
Well, put me down as an enthusiastic and optomistic customer on your list when you have parts to supply. I'll happily send you the dyno chart from the before and afterwards so you can add it to your database, (and hopefully sales pitch), as you ramp up production and try to recover some of the cost of all your time and investment etc.
Keep us informed,
Regards,
Well, put me down as an enthusiastic and optomistic customer on your list when you have parts to supply. I'll happily send you the dyno chart from the before and afterwards so you can add it to your database, (and hopefully sales pitch), as you ramp up production and try to recover some of the cost of all your time and investment etc.
Keep us informed,
Regards,
Post 688 by MrZ32,
#688KTM is working on its own intake mod, a little thing called the 1290 SuperDuke, you wont even have to book any Dyno time with it... at first anyway!
Post 689 by kevxtx,
#689I'll be sticking with my '07 Sd for a long time yet! Not interested in a new bike, don't need anymore power than I already got and I haven't got time to ride this one anyway
But tinkering with things and keeping up with the latest mods is something I'll always be interested in - especially if it's supporting enthusiastic forum members in what they do. I just want something to do with it when it's raining and something to occasionally get me away from work/kids/DIY.
I can't believe it's been over a year since I did anything remotely interesting with my bike to make it different or work better or look better or anything. I think I've done everything you can do now. I've got a spare subframe and engine mounting brackets that I'll get powder coated black soon and fit them. I got my eye on ordering a full-size carbon bellypan from Replicast one day but at £400+ it's very expensive, there hasn't been any second hand ones ever come up in the last six years. Ditto for carbon wheels, there was one set a few years ago but I couldn't justify the price at the time. (I bought my full-Ti system from the same guy instead).
I might be reduced to just taking the whole thing apart, cleaning it and putting it all back together again!!!
But tinkering with things and keeping up with the latest mods is something I'll always be interested in - especially if it's supporting enthusiastic forum members in what they do. I just want something to do with it when it's raining and something to occasionally get me away from work/kids/DIY.
I can't believe it's been over a year since I did anything remotely interesting with my bike to make it different or work better or look better or anything. I think I've done everything you can do now. I've got a spare subframe and engine mounting brackets that I'll get powder coated black soon and fit them. I got my eye on ordering a full-size carbon bellypan from Replicast one day but at £400+ it's very expensive, there hasn't been any second hand ones ever come up in the last six years. Ditto for carbon wheels, there was one set a few years ago but I couldn't justify the price at the time. (I bought my full-Ti system from the same guy instead).
I might be reduced to just taking the whole thing apart, cleaning it and putting it all back together again!!!
Post 690 by Stratkat,
#690absolutely nothing wrong with that you are to be commended!
Post 691 by MrZ32,
#691Post missing
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Post 692 by kevxtx,
#692I am always keen to try new mods & will go to great lenghts to make or produce a mod if I think it might work, as a I have always said the DVS mod is yours lets see where we can take it to & now it is close to sharing it with everyone quiet exciting.
Don't forget to pop around & collect the lipped stacks for Fridays runs.
Don't forget to pop around & collect the lipped stacks for Fridays runs.
Post 693 by One67,
#693Where are you doing the dyno runs ? Procycle?
Post 694 by MrZ32,
#694Post missing
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Post 695 by One67,
#695I'll actually be there on Thursday, getting a Bazzaz Z-fi fitted and a couple of maps done for my Freeride.
If I'm free on Friday I'll definitely come in for a look at the new DVS's, it's pretty exciting to be so close now eh ?, I know I'm pretty keen to get my hands on a set.
If I'm free on Friday I'll definitely come in for a look at the new DVS's, it's pretty exciting to be so close now eh ?, I know I'm pretty keen to get my hands on a set.
Post 696 by buddieb,
#696good luck!!
Post 697 by MrZ32,
#697Post missing
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Post 698 by One67,
#698So did your new DV stacks arrive James ?
Post 699 by Reb,
#699I can only imagine that these stacks are so freakin awesome that the boys are having such a blast riding they havn't found time to do a dyno report yet.
Post 700 by One67,
#700Please hurry up guys,its winter here but we still need them now LOL
Post 701 by buddieb,
#701I was with MrZ at the dyno on Friday, he was still waiting for the new stacks to arrive from the machinist as he had organised with them to deliver straight to the shop.
I left at midday and they hadn't arrived, so I hope it turned out allright for him.
The dyno guy we go to has a very good rep, so you have to book in 2 weeks in advance.
I left at midday and they hadn't arrived, so I hope it turned out allright for him.
The dyno guy we go to has a very good rep, so you have to book in 2 weeks in advance.
Post 702 by MrZ32,
#702So much for the luck of the Irish wha??
Post 703 by stalker,
#703Sorry guys... will post more soon. On friday my wisdom tooth became infected. .. they removed it on Saturday then the hole that was left became infected. .. been a fun few days but will post some of the results shortly
Post 704 by Mr_Trecolareco,
#704Post missing
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Post 705 by MrZ32,
#705Add me to the list on wanting some when you are done please
Post 706 by Doon,
#706i think the list would be easier to make, if it was the people that didnt want stacks
i think the whole forum is lined up
i think the whole forum is lined up
Post 707 by Nathan990,
#707Post missing
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Post 708 by MrZ32,
#708Before I market these and show figures. .. anyone in bris who had a cpr box, could I do a short swap with a motobox long enough to do some dyno runs with it. I can do the swap over fairly quickly.
I want to make sure that this airbox can deliver on the claims that I am going to show on the dyno.
As it apears that not all airbox"s are equal.
I want to make sure that this airbox can deliver on the claims that I am going to show on the dyno.
As it apears that not all airbox"s are equal.
Post 709 by Nathan990,
#709I would send my ITG filter over but Im going on 4000K trip tomorrow.
Post 710 by MrZ32,
#710I can do the swap, I have a CPR. I assume it will be safe to run the motobox on my current tune?
Post 711 by Keenaz,
#711Post missing
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Post 712 by MrZ32,
#712Sounds good, Ill stick with my map which will be fine. Pretty keen to try a motobox for comparison.
Sunday morning ride? are we doing the swap at yours, mine or on the side of the road?
Sunday morning ride? are we doing the swap at yours, mine or on the side of the road?
Post 713 by MrZ32,
#713yup - been lurking for a while.
Post 714 by MrZ32,
#714well as promised, here are some dyno runs showing where my bike has come since last year... with the modified rc8 stacks coming in this year (bear in mind a standard rc8 stack loses out everywhere except for the last 1000rpm), the cnc'd stacks are the ones which are the same as the modified SD stacks, the metal stacks are the original dvs and the cabon ones are the carbon fibre stacks. Please note that all runs unless it says custom tune are off the same akra base map.
I wont post the recent rc8 dvs stacks as they require a further tweak to work in all the airboxes and better in conjunction with the modified rc8 stacks (already designed, just waiting to get them made up). But it gives an idea of what is achievable.
I wont post the recent rc8 dvs stacks as they require a further tweak to work in all the airboxes and better in conjunction with the modified rc8 stacks (already designed, just waiting to get them made up). But it gives an idea of what is achievable.
Post 715 by Jermo,
#715please bear in mind that the first runs on the standard stacks were run on very rich settings... so 124+-1hp would be expected
Post 716 by MrZ32,
#716how much when
Post 717 by Jermo,
#717So if I get this correctly, the best run in this sheet on just the Akra mapping (129,20hp) is around 8hp better at the top compared to stock stacks (120,95hp) with just modified RC8 stacks without the DVS inserts? Or are the DVS included in this one?
Either way, this is a huge difference in power
Either way, this is a huge difference in power
Post 718 by MrZ32,
#718Post missing
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Post 719 by KTM666,
#719have you any fuel graghs to show if it is running lean with the new stacks
Post 720 by 990 WFO,
#720So the best is still to come? (modified RC8 stacks with DVS)?
Post 721 by MrZ32,
#721That is the plan. .. Best to come. ..
None of these runs with the modified lips were with dvs.
Just a few tweaks to go to suite all airboxes. ... Well that's the plan.
However for those who want the modified lipped rc8 stacks let me know. As the gains have been proven I'm happy to sell them... will just need to work out a price for if you want lipped sd stacks.
Will also do a deal for the guys who get these for the dvs when I'm happy to release them. I'm just not happy to release them just yet as I don't want to sell a product that I'm not entirely happy with
None of these runs with the modified lips were with dvs.
Just a few tweaks to go to suite all airboxes. ... Well that's the plan.
However for those who want the modified lipped rc8 stacks let me know. As the gains have been proven I'm happy to sell them... will just need to work out a price for if you want lipped sd stacks.
Will also do a deal for the guys who get these for the dvs when I'm happy to release them. I'm just not happy to release them just yet as I don't want to sell a product that I'm not entirely happy with
Post 722 by 990 WFO,
#722Post missing
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Post 723 by CEREC1,
#723+1! As well the lipped SD stacks!
As well the DVS!
Btw. great job!
Roland
As well the DVS!
Btw. great job!
Roland
Post 724 by 990 WFO,
#724Interested in the modified RC8 stacks (the ones that ran 129.2 hp on the Akra tune). Unless you're expecting the DVS RC8 stacks to put out at least another 3 horsepower on top of that, whats the price for the modded RC8 stacks plus shipping to the states?
Post 725 by 990 WFO,
#725The modified rc8 stacks are great but love to be tuned... due to the extra air speed created by them, you actually need to lean out the fuel mixture further than you would with standard stacks. Hence why after tuning produced 132.5hp
Post 726 by 990 WFO,
#726is there any loss of low mid rpm torqure as there normaly is with short stacks, I take it its just the lip thats been modified? will the dvs if there is any loss claw back the low to mid and/or increase it
Post 727 by MrZ32,
#727So you're saying that slapping on the modded RC8 stacks won't cause the bike to run dangerously lean? Sign me up!
Post 728 by 990 WFO,
#728So if we are going to get a custom map with TuneECU on a dyno what stacks do we go for
I'm almost more into mid-range improvements that just a peak BHP number
I'm almost more into mid-range improvements that just a peak BHP number
Post 729 by Jermo,
#729Just for the hell of it, I went out last night and installed the normal RC8 stacks I have. Weather finally cleared up today and I took it out for a spin. Initial impressions:
-Bike runs a lot smoother. Low revs are much easier to manage and even when the bike gets to 2K RPM it buzzes rather than bucks like it used to at 2.5K. The on/off low end throttle responds seems to be gone as well.
-Top end improved quite a bit. Somewhere around 7 to 8K the bike really keeps pulling hard where it would start to run out of steam.
-Believe it or not the sound is pretty different. The exhaust sounds the same of course but the intake doesn't sound as deep. Sounds more like a stream-lined pro super-bike than an angry street-fighter. I prefer the stock noise honestly but its not bad.
I don't really know how the power was effected. Like I said it feels like a big bump in top end but my pants dyno can't really tell a major difference as far as every day riding goes. The biggest improvement was the added smoothness, whether that gave the illusion of less torque or not I can't confirm. Over-all I'm pretty happy with the RC8 stacks and can't wait for the DVS/modded RC8 stacks.
-Bike runs a lot smoother. Low revs are much easier to manage and even when the bike gets to 2K RPM it buzzes rather than bucks like it used to at 2.5K. The on/off low end throttle responds seems to be gone as well.
-Top end improved quite a bit. Somewhere around 7 to 8K the bike really keeps pulling hard where it would start to run out of steam.
-Believe it or not the sound is pretty different. The exhaust sounds the same of course but the intake doesn't sound as deep. Sounds more like a stream-lined pro super-bike than an angry street-fighter. I prefer the stock noise honestly but its not bad.
I don't really know how the power was effected. Like I said it feels like a big bump in top end but my pants dyno can't really tell a major difference as far as every day riding goes. The biggest improvement was the added smoothness, whether that gave the illusion of less torque or not I can't confirm. Over-all I'm pretty happy with the RC8 stacks and can't wait for the DVS/modded RC8 stacks.
Post 730 by Linga,
#730Also the custom TUNEecu map I'm running seems to handle the new stacks well. Bike still smells rich at idle and I took it to ~8K RPM and pulled in the clutch and the revs plummeted evenly, no hesitation or popping. I would not recommend anyone install these on a stock map. They made a surprising amount of difference for $11 and a 20 minute install, and if it were my bike I would not feel comfortable riding around with these on a stock map. I may even switch over to the smoothened Akra map just to be on the safe side.
Post 731 by AGRO!,
#731Edit: I was wrong. Was messing around with a C5 Corvette on the highway and ran lean in the midrange. Went WFO and the bike just made noise but didn't go anywhere for about 1K RPM. Going to load up an Akra map later this evening. These stacks are no joke folks. Don't risk your engine for a few horsepower if you can't modify your tune.
Post 732 by Linga,
#732You are talking about standard rc8 stacks? If you are running the akra smoothened map you shouldn't have an issue. .. Other than running too rich.
Once running the modified rc8 stacks they run even richer. . Hence a custom map makes them even better
Once running the modified rc8 stacks they run even richer. . Hence a custom map makes them even better
Post 733 by AGRO!,
#733Post missing
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Post 734 by 990 WFO,
#734Post missing
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Post 735 by Jermo,
#735Post missing
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Post 736 by tripoddave,
#736Since the forum was offline for a while, I wonder if there's any new information about the DV stacks?
Post 737 by kevxtx,
#737Post missing
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Post 738 by kevxtx,
#738The last Dyno testing of the latest version 3D stacks showed poor Dyno results on my SMR.
Post 739 by Linga,
#739Post missing
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Post 740 by kevxtx,
#740I am not running any at the moment as I sold my SMR last month & am running in my new bike.
The older DVS versions worked the best & have proof from other independent Dyno tests on 2 other 990's, the latest DVS version seems to shroud the lower stack to much, in theory they looked great in Dyno practice they did not work on my bike, I know James sent a pair of the latest DVS to the UK for testing & they showed the simular results to my Dyno testing, the original DVS are just to hard to make & would cost a fare bit for mass production I would think, mine took me many hours to make.
That is life not every mod works out as planed, back to the drawing board.
The older DVS versions worked the best & have proof from other independent Dyno tests on 2 other 990's, the latest DVS version seems to shroud the lower stack to much, in theory they looked great in Dyno practice they did not work on my bike, I know James sent a pair of the latest DVS to the UK for testing & they showed the simular results to my Dyno testing, the original DVS are just to hard to make & would cost a fare bit for mass production I would think, mine took me many hours to make.
That is life not every mod works out as planed, back to the drawing board.
Post 741 by Colonel_Klinck,
#741The originals, were they the carbon inserts the same as I have mate?
Post 742 by kevxtx,
#742The only ones that have not shown any gains was the last design.
Post 743 by Colonel_Klinck,
#743We only had the modified stacks for UK test. Modded RC8 and SD. TBH they didn't produce any real gains but I'm taking them up to get bike dyno'd again at Track Electronics. If anyone can get performance out of them it's John.
Post 744 by nampus,
#744Klink,James told me about your results with the RC8 stacks and I had similar results.But with the original DVS that James kindly sent me (small round lipped)and with the fat lipped RC8 stack,my motor has never pulled so hard and that's at 97000kms.I did have the cam chains changed at the same time so that could of helped with more precise valve timing.Maybe James can send you a drawing of the original DVS so you can try and reproduce them.Maybe I just happened to be lucky with my setup(height of DVS in the stack)so the next time I have the tank off,I will take a pic and measurement.Cheers
Post 745 by d2r,
#745I have every dimension of every stack ever produced & would not share the spec's with anyone unless James asked me to, if anyone wants to know the dimensions I personally think the right thing to do is to contact James directly & ask him.
Post 746 by ktmguy,
#746I'll email James. Millar has a friend who owns a 3D printer. Millar is also a model maker so is a bit good at making things up from resin ect. Like Kecxtx says this is James's baby and it's all down to him. I am dyno'ing again at the beginning of next month so could test a DVS then. Would be great if they could be made to work cost wise. A lot of time and money has been ploughed into this by some. Also be great for the rest of us getting a bit more grunt
Post 747 by Linga,
#747it's been a while, any updates?
Post 748 by AGRO!,
#748Sent James a PM months ago and he still not looked at it.
Was told on another forum that his last results wernt very good
Was told on another forum that his last results wernt very good
Post 749 by ktmguy,
#749Wow, all the enthusiasm, research and hard work that went into this... not to mention the excitement it generated along the way. What ultimately happened to this?
Post 750 by AGRO!,
#750now that you mention, haven't heard or seen post from James for a while, what happened? Anyone?
Post 751 by SuperHoon,
#751I'll text him, but work and exams and such were pretty hard on him.
Also hard to fully test everything, and gains were hard to pin down.
I had some good results and some average ones trying out his gear.
Also hard to fully test everything, and gains were hard to pin down.
I had some good results and some average ones trying out his gear.
Post 752 by AGRO!,
#752I did see that he had his SD and MT01 for sale.
Post 753 by kevxtx,
#753Thanks for the updaye Agro, I guess, I'll just have to paddle my own canoe on this one If I do see a meaning full result I'll update this thread.
Post 754 by kevxtx,
#754Some stack info for you; Page 7, page 13, page 17, page 18, page 27, page 33, page 48: http://www.ktmsmt.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=3299
Post 755 by ktmguy,
#755Hi! Im going to put my bike on the dyno this spring. (Currently using a map from james).
Im wondering if theres a chans for me to buy a par of dvs? Currently running rc8 stacks in my rotty filter.
Im wondering if theres a chans for me to buy a par of dvs? Currently running rc8 stacks in my rotty filter.
Post 756 by kevxtx,
#756You would need to speak to James as all mine were given away.
Post 757 by kevxtx,
#757Post missing
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