Read-only archiveOriginal forum posts · 2005–2020

Superduke Max BHP at rear wheel

49 posts · Started by tripoddave · 13 Jan 2012

Archived topic · Replies closedJump to last post ↓

Post 1 by tripoddave,

#1
Can anybody tell me what the max BHP theyve known for a SD at the rear wheel.
I know the SDR 08 model has revised engine components but what about the normal 08 SD.
Do you recon a SD could be tuned"gas flowed head etc" and still run reliable with the extra power.

Post 2 by SDNerd,

#2
With no engine mods but with a DNA airbox and an Akrapovic evo system we saw 124 at the rear on Kev's dyno which reads about 6% low against a dynojet dyno.
It never made this figure again.
As we found out this was pushing the limit with the stock pistons as peak power was at 10,500 rpm which was about 1,000 more than was safe!!
We think it was making about 96bhp when we pulled it apart.
You should be able to see about 118/120 reliably with out internal mods.
We are about to find out what you get with gas flow, etc.

Post 3 by drswade,

#3
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 4 by MrZ32,

#4
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 5 by Crotchrockety,

#5
With MH airbox or stock air box, Leo carbon cans and PC3 with custom map I saw between 106 and 108. Never more.

Post 6 by darko,

#6
My 08 did 128.6 at the wheel... The 06 models have slightly different cams and have seen 134hp at the wheel

The reason for the mods was to increase low down torque and part throttle response for up in the mountains... Bike now pulls strongly from 3000rpm.

Post 7 by Colonel_Klinck,

#7
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 8 by SDNerd,

#8
Comparing dyno numbers is pointless. The same bike can run completely different numbers on two different dynamometers.

The dyno is a tuning tool. You do a baseline, you do your mods, then you run it again on the same dyno with the same operator. Anything else is just ego stroking.

Post 9 by MrZ32,

#9
I've seen Dyno sheets for 134/5 for SDRs with Hooligan box and aka slip ones on here. My 06 SD made 129.7 on HM Racings dyno last year. Full Akra, Motobox and 2nd flies out. It's a nice loose engine with 41k miles on it. Hoping to get flowed soon and MrZ32's DVS. With Tripodaves ignition advance map added to those I'm hoping to see some increases. How much only time (and some dosh) will tell.

I would be very wary of anyone claiming 140bhp at wheel from anything other than a very seriously modded SDR.

Post 10 by MrZ32,

#10
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 11 by TLS_Russ,

#11
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 12 by MrZ32,

#12
that being said... i wouldnt expect big number out of the states unless they are on race fuel... their fuel doesnt seem to be of the same quality (which is again a big shame... let alone all the mumps issues)

Post 13 by TLS_Russ,

#13
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 14 by Bigmeanie11,

#14
who's SDR is the one in the ebay add?

Post 15 by Crotchrockety,

#15
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 16 by Crotchrockety,

#16
Here is what my 08 SD did with MIvv slip on, Power Commander 5 with custom maps, SAS removed. Not bad and runs great. US bikes don’t seem to get as much HP.
Image

Post 17 by Bigmeanie11,

#17
Oh Christ, what did I start? Dyno wars? Yes, yes, I know all dynos are different. My point was not that an SD can't be tuned to make rwhp 148HP, its that it shouldn't be tuned to give 148 HP - at least not if its intended to be used on the street.

There are only two ways to increase HP. You either have to increase the torque or the rpms. The rest is simply math. Increasing either of these variables is going to introduce additional stresses in an engine. The issue is not can it be done, its can it be done and still have an engine that won't grenade? There are plenty of examples on this very site where folks have tried to hotrod the LC8 engine only to end up with weeping cylinder gaskets and grenaded pistons. So unless there was a hell of a lot more work done to this motor besides porting and polishing, i.e., lightening the pistons and thicker cylinder bolts, and increased cooling, one is asking for a catastrophic failure. As I said, caveat emptor.

Post 18 by Colonel_Klinck,

#18
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 19 by tripoddave,

#19
I was only trying to give an example...not start a war. Im very happy with mine and will be putting on some accessories soon.

Post 20 by Colonel_Klinck,

#20
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 21 by Crotchrockety,

#21
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 22 by Jermo,

#22
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 23 by indy84,

#23
Build the correct tool for the job at hand. Ask your self what are you after. Are you trying to keep up with the 1000 IL4's? Or do you want to pass them in the corners? Big'er HP is tricky to use in the corners. It's easy to over power the rear with the IL4's in the corners. The V-twin has more tractaple hp because it does not spin up as quick. I learned a lesson on usable hp on dirt bikes back in the mid 80's. A bud waxed my b-hind with his Suzuki PE-175 against my 430 Husky. He just pinned the throttle and railed away from me on the slippry, rocky trail when I could not find traction because I was over powering the rear wheel. Too much a good thing? Another thing to ask is where is all this extra power made? Wide open? Is that where you want the motor to live? My self, I love controllable power in the corners and coming out of them. Had a 87 1100 ILF that woud spin the rear in corners at 80 mph. Thank goodness for dirt bike skills when the rear steps out at that speed. Got to amit, it was cool as hell, I just stayed on the gas and rode it out. But it's more fun pinning it with less hp than tippy toeing around worrying about the rear stepping out.

Post 24 by MrZ32,

#24
Numbers on the dyno only count on that dyno only. I know a dyno that gives a Superduke 12bhp more then the same bike on a different dyno.
If you want the chart to say 140bhp, no problem, you can alter the correction values in the dyno software.

You need a before chart to see if this bike is made fast by mods or fast by choosing an optimistic dyno.

Post 25 by indy84,

#25
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 26 by MrZ32,

#26
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 27 by indy84,

#27
this is my 2008 sdr moto box end cans flys out otto ignition map pcv custom map, first run is sades map through tune ecu
Image off course it all means piss all if you cant use it

Post 28 by MrZ32,

#28
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 29 by TLS_Russ,

#29
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 30 by MrZ32,

#30
read my post before that one indy, no I cant use it 89 bhp felt alot better on track than 135 as I was able to pin it everywere, my bike is 90 % track, if I can sort it it will be 100% track its the only place I feel I can relax and use a bike as it should

Post 31 by kevxtx,

#31
That torque curve is quite different to mine. Mine sits on 65ftlb at 3k rpm... Yes different dyno but it shows that the lc8 motor loves fast airflow (not just big throttle bodies/valves). Interesting. Mine also peaks at 81 but is a bit flatter... That being said it was with the dvs'[/quote]
I rekon an sdr will hit the 140 mark with your dvs along with all thats been done to mine,which is big bhp for a twin in my books, I would love to know the difference between indys breather and non breather mod

Post 32 by MrZ32,

#32
At a guess (based on gains from other v-twins) 1-2hp at the back wheel. But it is not really gaining hp... Just getting rid of some restriction.

Post 33 by kevxtx,

#33
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 34 by loony888,

#34
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 35 by loony888,

#35
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 36 by Stratkat,

#36
i think that you mistook me for what i was saying... without increasing the compression ratio, the displacement or significantly increasing the octane and ignition advance

by allowing the airflow to travel faster (without restricting the volume of the airflow) (maximising the air that can flow in/out), the torque curve should not drop by much.

what is currently happening is once you get to around 7000 rpm, the the airflow is getting past its efficiency for and that is why you see the toque curve dropping off.

140hp only requires 76.5 (roughly) ft lb of torque at 9600 rpm (200 below that of the redline of an 07 model).. we are seeing bikes currently produce well over 80ft lb of torque... so it is not inconceivable for an sd to make 140hp at the wheel.

how can this be done? by allowing the airflow to flow as efficiently as possible... flowed heads (just cutting out material wont do it).. maybe a 5 angle cut on the valves.

im sticking with the viewpoint that on pump fuel, without raising compression, cubic capacity or going for custom cams (06 cams should be enough).. 140hp will be seen on the back wheel of an SD let alone an SDR

oh and as kev knows... i have a set of VS replacements that may just allow the airflow up top

Post 37 by Colonel_Klinck,

#37
I have ported quire a few motors over the years & have found the best results is using a flow benck & to CNC the ports to get equal dimensiond for both heads, then there is no guessing, the throttle bodies need to be attached as well as the stacks to get the exact flow of the intack system.

I have done 2 heads with a 5050 Raptor high lift cams on my XT660X Yamaha.

Stage1 flows 339@ 500 lift, flow only = 10 HP from head only US$700 all dyno proven
Stage2 flows 369@ 500 lift, +2mm inlet valves = 14 HP from head only US$1200 all dyno proven

The standard bikes hp went form 45 Hp to 74 rear wheel HP, big bore kit 686cc to 734cc, compression ratio from 10:1 to 12.5:1, head & cam work, +2mm bored throttle body with bigger throttle plate, DNA stage 3 air box, & full exaust system PCII with custom map. We now have a stroker crank on one whick produces 80 HP which is almost doulbe the standard HP, we will see how long this one will last before the big bang.

Post 38 by KTM666,

#38
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 39 by Colonel_Klinck,

#39
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 40 by KTM666,

#40
my 05/06 SD with a fresh rebuild, cleaned up inlet ports, multi angle valve job, dynamically balanced reciprocating mass, moto hooligan air box, SDR Headers, akro mufflers, O2 eliminators, SAS removed, motohooligan secondary flies in place and a PCIII.
Decent run in procedure on the dyno, then tuned PROPERLY made 128.95 RWHP at 9500 rpm. not sure on the peak torque figure, i'll post up the graphs when i pick it up.
This bike has STANDARD cams, pistons etc.

Post 42 by nampus,

#42
I still don't get this topic. A single dynosheet means nothing if you ask me.
For example: Image
Standard 07 superduke. With a pair of Leo vince exhausts. Nothing more, nothing less. Over 140 hp.

Post 43 by Viking,

#43
Good example Nampus. It's all internet bollocks.

There are no non R model bikes out there with a genuine 130rwhp without serious engine work. The standard bikes make 105 max at the wheel. Fact. So the bikes would need to get 25bhp from external breathing and exhaust mods.

Post 44 by nampus,

#44
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 45 by Viking,

#45
I'm gonna get the dyno guy to fook about with the correction and get me a printout for 170bhp so i can put it on the net so everyone will tell me how awesome my bike is.

Then i'm gonna get on track in 7 weeks time and find it's not any faster than the next SD out there. But i'll make up a good excuse like it's too hot or some shit.






Post 46 by nampus,

#46
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

Post 47 by 990 WFO,

#47
my only reason for going to any dyno is to set the fueling, once thats set I dont care its not like you can go around a track or road looking at a printout

Post 48 by Doon,

#48
Confusing title. Bhp is measured at the crank. Rwhp is obviously at the rear wheel. Just sayin. Good read though, been meaning to get my bike dyno'd but there are no local shops.

Post 49 by KTM666,

#49
Post missing

This post could not be recovered from the original forum.

End of archived topic · Posting is closedBack to top ↑
← Back to Hooliganism