Tuneboy

As posted by Tuneboy in the PC thread the TuneEdit software will be avaiable within a week or two. The key features are:

- Fuel mapping for front and rear cylinders.
- Ignition mapping (Front & rear)
- Rev limit change
- Idle speed adjustment
- Full diagnostics like the KTM dealer software can do

Besides these functions the most important aspect about Tuneboy is that it creates a completely new fuel map (can be based on an existing map) with FULL control over ALL parameters. The new map gets flashed into the ECU exactly like the original fuel maps from KTM. This is not a piggy back system that sits 'in' the bikes' wiring and manipulates certain values from various sensors like PC or Rapid Bike. So no extra wiring, box or connectors need to be installed.

Tuneboy allows the user to load different fuel/ignition maps into the ECU as much as you like or need. Including switching back to a KTM map if you want to. A 5 minute job with only a laptop and cable. The diagnostic feature is very sophisticated as well IMO.

This advantage of this approach is not to be underestimated IMO.

I have frequent contact with Wayne McDonald from Tuneboy (great guy) and I just saw the first dyno results which look very promising. No massive power gains (KTM is not totally crazy) but clear improvements at various areas throughout rev range. The air/fuel graphs do show massive improvements that usually indicate better rideability (throttle response, smoothness) and fuel economy. As said, these are first takes. More info to follow soon!

Richard.

Guys this is a simple thing, lets not complicate it. Which you prefer depends on your needs and preferences.

PC or RB
- Physical additional Plug-in module
- Interceptor functionality ie, takes the standard signal and modifies +/- for fuel only - it changes the injector pulse
- The PC3R and RB rel 3 do ignition and have other plugins - quickshift, EG meters, etc
- no feedback from EG sensors
- does not connect or change to the ECU, but retains all the ECU's abilities - as the ECU works without knowing the PC is there

Advantage over Tuneboy:
- you get Accellerator pump software
- you can buy add-ons like power shifters etc
- tuners are farmiliar with the programming (not many know the Tuneboy interface and have to learn)

TuneBoy
- ECU map editor - direct plug from PC to ECU for changes only
- Direct map changes to ignition, fuel, advances, everything
- No plug-ins... you are just changing your ECU settings
- Retains all functionality of the ECU, but can adjust - ie, idle, etc

Advantage over standard PC and RB:
- no extra unit to squeeze onto the bike somewhere
- you can change all settings including, ignition, fuel, idle, warmup, etc
- you get the full diagnostic checks over the ECU
- you get the ECU resets for settings like Throttle position sensor etc

As an end result, they both do the same thing, You should have your bike Dyno tuned regardless and they will give you the same results.
Maps, it is only a starting position, I would never run a map without Dyno'ing the bike to check it works and suits the bike/config/ etc.
Unless you have an identical bike setup identically....and are not fussy, hoping that your performs the 100% same as someone elses.

Re: Tuneboy, it is very popular in UK and Aus for Triumphs as well as Aprilia's. Have a look at their site for more info.
They already have connection to the Keihin ECU modules - so there is nothing new.
What are you paying for - a cable, software, and a huge amount of development time that the lads put in making it work.

Bottom line - its your choice!

In 10 years we have not had a single ECU failure.
The changes made to the KTM ECU are to the map data only, not the program code that is running in the bike.
Any changes you make with the TuneBoy software can be reversed by simply opening the standard map and clicking the download button, so you can fiddle away and switch back to standard very easily.
When you take your bike to the dealer with a PC fitted they would have every right to refuse any engine related warranty claims, the only way they will know you have used the TuneBoy software on the bike is if you tell them, not that I am saying you should not tell them.
I agree that adjusting the rev limit is a waste of time unless you see the power is still increasing, or you are using the bike on the track and want a little over rev to allow you to hold a gear longer.
Idle speed adjustment and diagnostic features are handy to have, the latter can save costly visits to the dealer.
It is true that the best results will be found by tuning each individual bike, but that does not mean you won't get a big improvement by downloading a map that was developed on another bike.
KTM are forced to make compromises in the mapping to satisfy EURO3 and other emission laws, this means they make the bike run lean in the lower part of the rev range. A map that address's this on one bike will still work better than the standard map when it is loaded into another bike.
We will try to provide as many modified maps for the KTM as we can.

Here are the results from a standard 990 SD
Blue line is before, red line is after remap with TuneBoy software.


These next graphs show air/fuel ratio before and after for 100%, 75%, 45% and 20% throttle. Again blue is before and red is after remap.






We connected the wide band O2 sensor to each cylinder and adjusted air/fuel for individual cylinders.
This bike had standard pipes and to my knowledge was completely standard.

Just for info I got this reply from Tuneboy this morning regarding availability.......


Hi Rick,

Things are nearing completion. We are waiting for a shipment of connectors for this bike. Once we have these there is only a little testing to be done and it should be available. All up, I'd guess about three more weeks.

Will keep you posted. Thanks for your patience!

Best Wishes,

Emma

Dr. F, why are you trying so hard to pitch the PC as the better or at least more sensible choice?

The 'advantage' of all the Dyno centers and people who have knowledge and experience with the PC is of less value than you picture IMO. Here in NL you can safely say that 80% of these 'experienced' people don't know half of what they're doing. The number of bikes running around with half decent set up PCs is countless. With their respective owners being very happy with them BTW.

But at the end of the day you're right, there will be more experience with the PC out there than with Tuneboy. At the same time, you only need ONE skilled center or mechanic to set up your bike.

Although the end result can be comparable, there is no question about the technical superiority of the Tuneboy approach to optimize an FI system. Downloading optimized fuel/ignition maps into the ECU the same way as the manufacturer does opposed to sensor tricking with add on cables, connectors and boxes. From a reliability point of view the PC approach is inferior by definition. All the add-on stuff can lead to trouble and/or failure.

Richard.

I thought there were a few free countries still around... that sounds like fascism and military rule to me.

Nothing here in Aus... do what you want but follow the rules - which are published. That sounds fair to me.

The Tuneboy software opens up the maps & ECU completely therefore everything that is controlled by the fuel map parameters (and ECU if editable) can be changed/edited with Tuneboy. As said before, Tuneboy allows the user to create completely new fuel maps from scratch or modify existing ones. Exactly like it's done at the factory.

Richard

Does anybody know when the TuneBoy will be available or is it a red herring like the 2004 RSVR?

It is real... they have dyno tuned a SD in Sydney for testing.
I have no real dates yet - sorry. I am waiting just like you

Are they testing the Tuneboy on the new 2007 model or is all this based on 2005/6 model SDs?

It will come, don't worry.

It's still only a matter of parts supply (contact pins) that keeps the product from being available. While frustrating, it's not that our SDs are running that bad that we can't wait a while I think.

Looking at the graphs above it's clear what TB will do. Get the A/F ratio right at various throttle positions which are way off standard and with the Akra map(s). The engine will feel and respond a lot better, gain a little power here and there and last but definitely not least, it will burn less fuel...

R.

Latest news from Emma at Tuneboy.....

Hi Rick,

We received the connectors yesterday. We're still waiting for the pins to finish the product. The supplier is yet to get back to us on the delivery of the pins. Wayne still needs to do some more testing but I think he'll be able to do this soon.

I'm sorry it's taking so long.

Emma


I bet she's quite a babe

I know guys, I'm sorry.

I have TuneEdit for KTM fully operational and running on my PC. We had a few 'holes & bumps' to take with the beta version and it's perfectly stable and reliable now.

I've edited a few maps, downloaded them to the bike, changed idle speed etc. It works absolutely perfect. Tuesday next week (May 22) I'll be taking my bike to the Dyno & Tuneboy specialist in NL to remap my bike on the dyno.

The story about those pins must sound like a brush off by now but I can assure you it's really the truth. I'm in contact with Wayne from TuneBoy a few times a week. The pins are of a very specific type and I understand that only one company in Aus is able to make/supply them. I just heard that the pins are finally on their way so that's great news!!

Below an example of some playing around with TuneEdit I did last night. The top graphs is the KTM map for the full Akra system, front & rear cylinder. As you can see they are pretty rough and spikey. In TuneEdit you can see exactly which point in the graph corresponds to which throttle position and RPM. With the engine running it shows where it is in the fuel map real time. Impressive...




The two bottom graphs is how I changed it. Note how much smoother it is. The low section just before the rise in both graphs is 3500 - 4000 RPM. A rough fueling spot on my bike. I've leaned off mixture before this point with some 6% and richened it up after this point with the same amount and smoothed the graphs by eye.

Please note that I have NO IDEA if this works because you need a dyno & gas analyser to see what really happens. It's just to play around!! I downloaded this tune to the bike and have to take it for a spin to see what happens.

Watch this space...

Richard.

This just in - you can now place an order

email from Stuart @ Tuneboy

The cable and software is now finalised and the first batch of cables are now in production! We expect to receive this first batch in the UK in the first week of June 2007.

The standard price is £230, however we are running an introductory offer of £190 for pre-orders until the end of May 2007.
You can order quickly and easily online at http://www.tuneboy.co.uk/buynow.asp

Cool
I`ve just placed my preorder

The answer on this is a lot more complicated than the question...

As I said in my last update after the dyno work, we ran into some booby trap in the KTM fuel map(s). We have done a lot of extra testing the last week with a number of technical changes in the programs. The problem seems to be related to the Akra map for the full Ti Akra system alone. As things look now the full Akra map seems to shut off both O2 sensors for some reason. However, this doesn't explain completely why the engine didn't respond on changes in a certain area of the fuel map.

The stock and Akra maps for the slip-ons don't seem to have this problem. This morning I've completed another series of tests and TuneBoy is working on that as I write this.

Don't hold it against me but my guess is that the issues will be solved in a day or two.

I can say that I've downloaded a different fuel map about 35 times now and it works perfect.

To be continued...

Thank you for all your effort mate, I really appreciate it! Keep us posted!

Now then. I've just placed my order for the tune boy and Stuart said it should be with me by next week! WooHoo!!

Apparantly the cables have arrived today and after a few tweeks to the full Akra map, they should be on their way!

Got mine today too.

Hey KTMax. Will the supplied tunes be ok working with the 07 model?

Cheers

Rog

Now I have to leave work and go home!!!!!!

OK, handy hint No1:
The instructions don't mention that you need to load a KTM tune into the program before it will communicate with your bike and let you get your ECU serial. If you're an anorak like me you won't be surprised when you see what your serial # is.

Yeah I get that far, but he big button doesn't do anything

I've given up for now as I had the cable running out from my PC through the window to the bike in the drive. I've put it to bed for the night now.

I just emailed Wayne so hopefully he'll be able to help. The new version of TE at least got me authenticated (V3.3.1) and I can see the map I think I need.

My brain hurts

Hmm, you're beyond my experience. Once I was Authenticated and had a map loaded that was it, ready to go.

BigThumpa, what were the two maps for, that you had by email?

This is from Stuart Homer... "The maps on the CD are the maps as used by the Aprilia dealer; we haven't supplied any customised maps. I believe the off road map is the full Akrapovic system rather than just the slip on."

I think he meant KTM dealer...

You running standard cans and mapping?

My bike is 06 with the Akrapovic end cans fitted. I had the Akrapovic map installed by the KTM dealer , but it only works well with the end can inserts removed...

I still can't see the point of a Tuneboy,especially as you are paying for a product that you have to try and install yourself,which seems very difficult,judging from the above experiences !!



As posted by Tuneboy in the PC thread the TuneEdit software will be avaiable within a week or two. The key features are:

- Fuel mapping for front and rear cylinders.
- Ignition mapping (Front & rear)
- Rev limit change
- Idle speed adjustment
- Full diagnostics like the KTM dealer software can do

Besides these functions the most important aspect about Tuneboy is that it creates a completely new fuel map (can be based on an existing map) with FULL control over ALL parameters. The new map gets flashed into the ECU exactly like the original fuel maps from KTM. This is not a piggy back system that sits 'in' the bikes' wiring and manipulates certain values from various sensors like PC or Rapid Bike. So no extra wiring, box or connectors need to be installed.

Tuneboy allows the user to load different fuel/ignition maps into the ECU as much as you like or need. Including switching back to a KTM map if you want to. A 5 minute job with only a laptop and cable. The diagnostic feature is very sophisticated as well IMO.

This advantage of this approach is not to be underestimated IMO.


If it's a 5 minute job,howcome most people have spent a few hours and then given up ?




I've just picked up my bike,having has a full Akra Evo system installed,and the bike is transformed.

I'm told that the remap supplied with the system was actually refined by KTM Sommer,who are the biggest KTM tuners/dealer in Germany.


I can't see how a guy on a computer churning out the Tuneboy maps can do better than the Sommer guys with their resources ?

I think you need to read up on how rich the Akro map actually is..... very

I take it you're talking about a mid eighties Gixxer 1000 right?...

Unless ridden by a complete twat with his pants full and two gears to high there is no way an SD can keep up with the current 1000, let alone catching one. It has at least 50 HP more and weights about the same.

The idle speed is easy to change with 'Tune Constants' under the Edit menu. Obviously, after changing the idle value you have to download the map to the ECU again to take effect.

The available tunes are a starting point. Not perfect one-size-fits-all tunes as there is no such thing. The power of TB is the possibility to perfectly tune your bike on the dyno.

Mine doesn't run on Vista either, the drivers for the cable crash the operating system every time I shut Tune Edit down. I was going to look into it more at my end but then I crashed my SD and it's not back up and running yet.......

I have started trying to map my SD with Tuneboy and have come up with the following problems/observations. Has anyone else got into Tuneboy mapping yet and have similar problems?. Maybe it just affects my bike?. I have Emailed Wayne/Tuneboy but no reply yet.

1. F1/L1 and F2/L2 tables are reversed. In other Tuneboy applications, eg Harley/Aprillia, the F1 map is for the front cylinder and the F2 map is for the rear cylinder however on my SD the opposite is true. The SD Tuneboy doesn't actually indicate which map belongs to which cylinder, it just states 1 and 2. I am concerned my bike is running with a rear map on the front cylinder and vice versa.

2. Idle is controlled by the F maps. I though the L maps would have controlled fuelling for idle because they are supposed to be for zero to 6% throttle, which would include idle?.

3. Fuel % trim affects both F1 and F2 maps. I thought this table should only affect cylinder 1 (F1) because there is a separate table for cylinder 2 (F2) called "Fuel % trim (cyl 2)".